case: (Default)
Case ([personal profile] case) wrote in [community profile] fandomsecrets2017-03-20 06:38 pm

[ SECRET POST #3729 ]


⌈ Secret Post #3729 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 36 secrets from Secret Submission Post #533.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-20 11:10 pm (UTC)(link)
I've reached the point in my life where porn just bores the crap out of me. Needless to say, I'm a bicycle free zone since I just don't see the point. Now, if you want to take the wheels off the bicycle and write Mr/Ms Cockslut settling down, I might give that fic a chance, but my eyes will glaze over when they start fucking.

This probably has nothing to do with the secret. Alaz.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-20 11:25 pm (UTC)(link)
This is so relevant to me right now. YES.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-20 11:49 pm (UTC)(link)
Whoa I was close to submitting a secret that said I didn't like that my favorite character was the fandom bicycle.

Not for the same reason as OP of course. I don't really think smut has to be in character it's just for fun and self-indulgent most of the time, a lot of canons don't really get into a characters sex life so fanfic writers have free reign.

I also have no problem shipping canon hetero characters in same sex relationships because the amount of actual gay and lesbian characters is... not much.

Secret OP

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 12:53 am (UTC)(link)
"Not for the same reason as OP of course. I don't really think smut has to be in character it's just for fun and self-indulgent most of the time, a lot of canons don't really get into a characters sex life so fanfic writers have free reign. "

I guess I like my smut to be relatively in-character. I know most canons don't get explicitly into character's sex lives, but there's often some reasonable hints regarding the sexuality of characters and their general personalities, and wildly deviating from that just makes me twitch a bit. If you want to wildly deviate, at least tag it instead of expecting that everybody wants to read an explicit four paragraph flashback about how their fandom fave who is straight in canon got picked up by two guys in a bar and had his gay cherry popped in hours of wild mano a mano a mano sex.

"I also have no problem shipping canon hetero characters in same sex relationships because the amount of actual gay and lesbian characters is... not much."

See my other comments about this. I ship canon hetero characters in same gender relationships but I also try to respect the fact that in canon up to that point at least, they've been heterosexual. Part of writing them getting together with another same gender character is them discovering themselves in my opinion. I dislike the "oh they've always been gay/bi" thing because 99% of the time it doesn't seem to fit the character, and it seems more like a lazy writing tool than an actual legitimate narrative choice because I constantly see it employed in situations where it's like:

Girl One: "Oh great we now know we have complicated feelings for one another, but...are you sure you want to have sex with me? I'm a little confused about all this myself but I know I want to have sex with you, but you've always been...pretty vocal about being into guys."

Girl Two: "Pfft naaaah I've secretly always been into chicks. Let the pussy eating commence!"

"Whoa I was close to submitting a secret that said I didn't like that my favorite character was the fandom bicycle. "

I'll admit I'm a little confused now though, why don't you like your favourite characters being the fandom bicycle? You didn't really give a reason and now I'm curious!

Re: Secret OP

(Anonymous) - 2017-03-21 02:07 (UTC) - Expand

Secret OP again!

(Anonymous) - 2017-03-21 02:21 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) 2017-03-20 11:51 pm (UTC)(link)
hahaha, AWESOME picture choice, OP

(also agree with content of secret.)

I knew immediately what I wanted to use for the photo...

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 12:56 am (UTC)(link)
I remembered seeing one of those dildo bikes posted somewhere before and I immediately thought that it was the absolute most perfect visual representation of what a "fandom bicycle" would look like without mentioning any specific characters to illustrate the concept lol.
kallanda_lee: (Default)

[personal profile] kallanda_lee 2017-03-20 11:51 pm (UTC)(link)
I know what you're saying but i'm torn on this because I also like my faves in sexual situations.

Secret OP

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 12:45 am (UTC)(link)
I like my faves in sexual situations too! I just like those sexual situations to be well written and generally in-character. :( I feel like most of the time when I see this done it's usually either because it's an obvious kink on the author's part to imagine a character just getting dicked by random men (when a canon straight guy is suddenly "addicted to cock"...yeah), or because the author is feeling lazy and doesn't want to put in the effort of writing a character discovering their sexuality isn't quite as rigid as they thought it was.

Re: Secret OP

[personal profile] kallanda_lee - 2017-03-21 00:54 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) 2017-03-20 11:57 pm (UTC)(link)
I get the cockslut part sooo much. The good-looking guy in a fandom was headcanoned as sleeping around and it annoys me so much. Instant back-button from me.

But then I'm also kinda weird that I headcanon characters as virgins and I stop reading if my pet virgin is mentioned to have had his cherry popped already.

Would still happily read about my OTP having happy enthusiastic sex every day of the week, though.

Secret OP

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 12:41 am (UTC)(link)
"But then I'm also kinda weird that I headcanon characters as virgins and I stop reading if my pet virgin is mentioned to have had his cherry popped already."

Lol I feel you. This isn't a thing for all characters--there are plenty of characters where I feel they've had sex before, just not usually with men. But generally I do back-button if a straight (as in mentioned it in canon) character suddenly offhandedly mentions having had gay sex and being attracted to men, just because it's part of that OOC thing I was talking about. I don't mind reading smut that has them slowly discovering themselves (usually with my character of choice, I admit), but I'm not a fan of retconning canon pasts/parts of a character's personality just to brush over that part of things since in my mind that's a huge part of said characters actually getting together. If a guy has mentioned in canon that he's not into other men, why is he suddenly some cock-hungry beast in your fic with no explanation? That drives me nuts. I'd prefer reading about the straight character navigating his sudden feelings of love and attraction to someone of the same sex.

(Part of what drives me insane is that the characters that are suddenly cock-hungry beasts are characters where it's so damn ridiculous too a lot of the time. Half of the characters I'm thinking of seem like they could barely score a kiss much less have a secret past full of casual sex with both genders (or just men or just women).)

"Would still happily read about my OTP having happy enthusiastic sex every day of the week, though."

I think that goes without saying. :D

(Anonymous) 2017-03-20 11:58 pm (UTC)(link)
For me, if a character is casual/promiscuous but Super Straight, unless there are other openly gay characters in the same story, I will tend to just assume - or at least consider it legit to assume - that the hyperstraightness is a function of the celluloid closet/heteronormative assumptions by the network/Leading Heroes Can't Be Queer Because Middle America. And I just don't consider that....like...intrinsic to the characters in a way that matters to how I imagine IC.

I'm bisexual but in a Movie About My Life I bet that wouldn't get included, you know? I'm not saying it's CANON that there's some numinous queer truth underneath dudebro tv shows, but like....I don't think it's a stupid or gratuitous way to engage with media either.

Secret OP

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 12:31 am (UTC)(link)
In the case of one of the fandoms I was thinking about when I wrote this, the canon does have other queer characters. Fandom just wanted this particular guy to be the fandom bicycle because he's the "fandom hottie".

Full disclosure, I wouldn't even care if people write him slowly discovering he's also into guys. I ship him with another guy (he's not conventionally hot enough for fandom though so the ship is not very popular compared to other purely smut ships involving the first guy and random hot men he's barely interacted with) because they have a ton of chemistry in canon. But I also don't erase the character's canon ladies man past. You can write all the hot smut without just veering off into complete OOC land. :(

I guess what bothers me most about this is how well accepted it is, to the point where people don't tag for it.

nayrt

(Anonymous) - 2017-03-21 04:19 (UTC) - Expand

Re: nayrt

(Anonymous) - 2017-03-21 05:50 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 12:37 am (UTC)(link)
I've got to agree with you there, OP.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 12:59 am (UTC)(link)
I tend to ignore canon for straight characters because there aren't enough non-stereotyped gay or bi characters. Congrats, bi people do exist!

Secret OP

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 02:03 am (UTC)(link)
Congrats, I know bi people exist because I am one!

But "bi" doesn't automatically equal "massive cockslut" either, which is a disturbingly common characterization and strays way too close to the "bis are greedy and hypersexual" stereotype for me to be comfortable with. Lots of people seem to think "bi" is shorthand for "now I get to write about ____ straight character getting bent over six ways to Sunday by random dudes". There's never any variety to the depictions of canonly straight characters being portrayed as bisexual, it's almost always used as a lazy narrative tool so authors don't have to write someone discovering their sexuality. It's often a way to retcon a canon sexuality in under two sentences, or an excuse to write OOC smut and then not tag it.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 01:09 am (UTC)(link)
I love my fandom bicycles!

Don't like? Don't read.

Secret OP

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 01:58 am (UTC)(link)
The problem is so many people think everyone loves their fandom bicycles.

Trust me, I'd fucking love to follow "Don't Like;Don't Read", but when people feel so entitled to their fandom bicycle headcanons that they think everybody else wants to read about that time ____ character reminisces about getting into a random gangbang bukkake that they don't feel the need to tag that shit, I take issue with it. And it happens way too often, this isn't a tiny minority of badly behaved people either, like half the time it's not tagged.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 02:09 am (UTC)(link)
You could apply the same logic to fandom secrets and opinions that you disagree with. And yet, here we are.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 01:12 am (UTC)(link)
I have a problem with the opposite: where there is no sex until a character is much older or a character has very little experience. Sure, it happens, but not as much as I see in fanfiction.

Secret OP

(Anonymous) - 2017-03-21 02:10 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 04:07 am (UTC)(link)
Agree with you OP, I follow two favorite authors (who often band together and are otherwise good) who write a character who reads almost asexual at times(or at very least sexually repressed) as constantly hungry for cock and willing to have sex with anyone.

With no explanation, he just suddenly is.

Even when I read smut, I like there to be some fundamental similarities between the character and someones interpretation.
were_lemur: (Default)

[personal profile] were_lemur 2017-03-21 04:19 am (UTC)(link)
I can't agree with the actual secret, but I lol'd at the picture.

Hmm.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 05:16 am (UTC)(link)
I do like an explanation if a character is going from ladies man to all about the guys, even a throwaway one (oh, yeah, apparently I was deep in denial, my family/friends/bullying/self-image issues, you know).

At the same time, I find that a good writer can make me go along with a character who seems to be very buttoned-down or even repressed having had lots of casual sex if they do it right. Like, I could see Benton Fraser somehow seeing a certain type of sex as a bodily need that should be taken care of periodically and having ample opportunity, he would, and he would compartmentalize that differently from being intimate and making love and not have an issue with it.

But you're probably talking about the writers that just want to get to the smut and sometimes sacrifice the character to get there. And that's fine for the writers and the readers who don't mind, but you would probably like a warning that that's what they are doing. And it would be pretty simple, too - all they would have to write is something like: OOC smut, and you would know to steer clear. Some people do, not many though. I think you're right, there's this perception that fanfic is for porn and some writers are basically just picking their characters for the aesthetic (and possibly for the enthusiasm or sheer magnitude of the fen).

Secret OP

(Anonymous) - 2017-03-21 06:02 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 05:34 am (UTC)(link)
I always thought fandom bicycle meant a character that gets shipped with everyone across the fandom, not someone commonly written as promiscuous. Maybe fandom language changed in the last couple years, since nobody in the thread picked up on it.

Secret OP

(Anonymous) - 2017-03-21 05:52 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) 2017-03-21 05:45 am (UTC)(link)
And here I thought "fandom bicycle" meant "a character I like and can easily ship with pretty much anyone", not "a character who gets written like a cockslut". Did the definition change?

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[personal profile] dancing_serpent - 2017-03-21 10:58 (UTC) - Expand

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