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Case ([personal profile] case) wrote in [community profile] fandomsecrets2017-08-07 06:24 pm

[ SECRET POST #3869 ]

⌈ Secret Post #3869 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.



[Doctor Who]




[Mandy Patinkin and Okieriete “Oak” Onaodowan in Natasha, Pierre & the Great Comet of 1812]


[Parks and Rec]


[Agent Tammy Preston in Twin Peaks]


[Doctor Who, Eighth Doctor]


Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 28 secrets from Secret Submission Post #554.
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Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

[personal profile] fscom 2017-08-07 10:25 pm (UTC)(link)
[Mandy Patinkin and Okieriete “Oak” Onaodowan in Natasha, Pierre & the Great Comet of 1812]

(Anonymous) 2017-08-07 11:04 pm (UTC)(link)
People didn't know about the tickey sales till well after it was announced

(Anonymous) 2017-08-07 11:10 pm (UTC)(link)
Even with that taken into consideration, most people who are even a little bit familiar with theater usually recognize that a show will occasionally bring on a famous person to increase ticket sales and as publicity. It happens all the time and assuming it's a race issue doesn't really make sense in this situation.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-07 11:30 pm (UTC)(link)
But it was also an issue where Oak left his scheduled run early to make space for Patinkin. It was at the very best really bad messaging.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-07 11:40 pm (UTC)(link)
That wasn't handled well, though if the issue was that ticket sales were so disastrously low that the show was in danger of closing altogether, I could understand the reasoning. But it's still nothing to do with race, and assuming that it's an issue of race seems like jumping to conclusions.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-07 11:49 pm (UTC)(link)
Being concerned about it as an issue of race was reasonable at the time because of the poor communications. Thinking it was about race now would be silly, but I haven't seen people saying that after the made the full announcement.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-08 12:16 am (UTC)(link)
Sorry, I don't agree. Maybe if they'd brought on an obscure white guy to replace Onaodowan, I could see people misunderstanding and thinking it's about race. But they didn't. They brought on Mandy Patinkin. He's not just any random white guy, he's a very well known white guy with a long history in movies, TV AND the theater - much, much longer than Onaodowan's. When you see a show announcing a big star taking over a role, it's about money and publicity, period.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-08 12:26 am (UTC)(link)
I don't think that's really the way people were talking about though. There was more the perception that Oak was treated disrespectfully in a way he might not have been if he was white.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-08 12:37 am (UTC)(link)
For that to be true, you'd have to argue that a white actor whose performance wasn't bringing in the expected ticket sales wouldn't have been replaced. I'm not sure that's true? Do shows willingly go bankrupt because they're so racist they're going to blindly give a white actor a huge break even if it's costing them lots of money? I'm a bit skeptical.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-08 01:04 am (UTC)(link)
Well, first of all, the whole point is that people didn't know it was a situation where they needed the ticket sales to avoid closing the show. That's the piece that people were unaware of. Obviously they would make more money with Mandy but I don't think people knew it was necessary to keep the show open.

Second, again, it was a question of how the thing was treated and communicated out and the appearance that Oak was being treated disrespectfully for no reason. Again, this turns our not to have been the case, but it was a reasonable assumption because of the bad communication.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-08 06:09 am (UTC)(link)
I have a feeling you're on this crusade because you really like Patinkin.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-08 01:21 am (UTC)(link)
Yes, the reaction to this was ridiculous. It was obvious from the beginning that the decision had nothing to do with race. No one seems to mention the fact that this has been an extremely race-blind show from the beginning--two of the female leads, including Natasha herself, are black. The show has embraced diversity since it was off-Broadway. There certainly are decisions and shows which reflect prejudicial casting, but this isn't one of them.

What irks me about things like this is that this kind of outcry is actually likely to make other shows LESS likely to cast people of color. Why cast a black man and risk this kind of PR nightmare when you can cast Whitey McWhite and be safe?

tldr; When Mandy Patinkin wants to be in your show and has very limited availability, of course you make room for him.

It also isn't as if Onaodowan would never play Pierre again. Just that his initial run was going to be cut short.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-08 01:37 am (UTC)(link)
I don't think anyone really thought that it was JUST about race, though. I don't think people were out there saying that they cast Mandy Patinkin solely because he was white. The argument was more that Onaodowan was treated unfairly and that this was partly because of his race. I really think, if anything, you're overreacting here. People aren't going to stop casting POC leads because of this. Don't be ridiculous.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-09 02:20 am (UTC)(link)
Stop casting them, no. But perhaps hesitate because they're afraid of the PR nightmare that might arise from what's a pretty common business practice? Quite likely, and that's a shame because race shouldn't have anything to do with it.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-08 06:01 am (UTC)(link)
Patinkin was also pissed off that the producers told him he was coming in at the end of Onaodowan's contracted run when in fact they were cutting Onaodowan's run short to bring in Patinkin early. As soon as Patinkin found out, he refused to take the role when he had been lied to about the circumstnaces. So whether or not race is involved, don't be stupid enough to lie to the star you're trying to entice! They could have worked it out with the two actors (maybe have Onaodowan do the rest of his contracted run after Patinkin) but instead they made shit up and lost both actors.

(Anonymous) 2017-08-08 04:17 am (UTC)(link)
Just want to say that I love Onaodowan so much ;;

(Anonymous) 2017-08-09 02:22 am (UTC)(link)
They just announced that the show is closing. It's too bad the producers weren't more transparent with their decision making. Might have spared everyone a lot of heartache AND given the show a bit more longevity.