case: (Default)
Case ([personal profile] case) wrote in [community profile] fandomsecrets2017-03-12 03:52 pm

[ SECRET POST #3721 ]


⌈ Secret Post #3721 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 28 secrets from Secret Submission Post #531.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-12 09:01 pm (UTC)(link)
I have no idea what you're trying to say here. Those complaints don't seem at all contradictory.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-12 09:24 pm (UTC)(link)
As far as I can interpret, the criticism of a BBC Sherlock 19th century AU is that a Sherlock 19th Century AU doesn't make sense - that's just actually Sherlock Holmes

but that doesn't actually make sense as a criticism, because if you've already said that BBC Sherlock and ACD Sherlock have different characterizations, of course people who prefer the BBC Sherlock version are going to go back and write stories in the same setting and consider them AUs. By the same logic used by people who criticize BBC Sherlock, a 19th century BBC Sherlock AU is actually distinct from the original canon

(Anonymous) 2017-03-12 09:46 pm (UTC)(link)
AYRT - Okay, so, assuming that it's even the same people making these complaints: They don't like BBC!lock. They complain about the characterisation.
Then they see a 19th century AU for BBC!lock, and they feel aggrieved because a) BBC!lock isn't very good to begin with, and b) if you're after that sweet, sweet Victorian aesthetic, why not go with the original? Or one of the other, much more faithful screen interpretations?

Personally, I don't give a toss - I watched the first season and that's it, and I'm not that into ACD overall - but the vibe I've picked up from others has felt more 'why not consume this far better thing' than 'this thing just doesn't make sense'.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-12 09:59 pm (UTC)(link)
Eh

I agree personally, but I'm also not sure how comfortable I am saying that the ACD!Sherlock is just *better* than BBC!Sherlock and no one should prefer BBC Sherlock

(Anonymous) 2017-03-12 09:09 pm (UTC)(link)
this entire secret leaves me deeply confused. sincerely, a person who has read about 75% of the original Holmes stores and has watched all of Sherlock except the newest season (waiting to watch it with my mom next week)

(Anonymous) 2017-03-12 09:44 pm (UTC)(link)
Why not? I wouldn't say anything about it in a review, but I think it's kind of funny that people want to write Sherlock fic set in the original ACD Sherlock Holmes setting, but with the modern characters who bear only a superficial resemblance to ACD's characters.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-12 10:01 pm (UTC)(link)
if you already think that they're different characters, why should it be surprising when some people prefer the Sherlock version?

(Anonymous) 2017-03-12 10:03 pm (UTC)(link)
Who are you talking to? I didn't say I was surprised.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 08:18 am (UTC)(link)
but with the modern characters who bear only a superficial resemblance to ACD's characters.

But that's the point. Fans of the BBC series love the characters as they are in the BBC series. It's those characters we want to see in the original setting, because it seems like it would be fun to see the characters we love in that setting.

There are a few ACD fans out there who get all exasperated and say, "If you want to see Holmes and Watson in Victorian England, why don't you just read the original stories?" But those fans are often the same fans (aka purists) who are going "Ugh, BBC Sherlock is such an awful bastardization of Sherlock Holmes. It's not true to the stories or the characters in the least." Meanwhile, the BBC fans are like, "THAT'S WHY WE DON'T JUST READ THE ORIGINAL STORIES. Because it isn't THOSE characters we love and want to see have adventures in Victorian England; it's the BBC John and Sherlock - who, as you just said, are NOT THE SAME as the ACD Holmes and Watson."

(I do think OP's secret was unclearly worded though, if this is what they were getting at.)

(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 06:36 pm (UTC)(link)
I understand that, you don't have to explain it. I still think it's funny.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 01:38 am (UTC)(link)
IME, people in fandom will complain about what bothers them and are remarkably disinclined to change that just because someone else believes there's nothing to complain about.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 03:25 am (UTC)(link)
The show did it's own 19th century AU. That fic writers would do it should surprise no one.

karmic justice

(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 04:06 am (UTC)(link)
OMG I didn't even know this is a thing. This is so karmic justice for the ACDers who bitched about Ritchie Holmes fans charging in and mucking up their pretty 'verse.

I am laughing so hard rn.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 05:39 am (UTC)(link)
Well, you're charming, aren't you? Maybe it was attitudes like yours that pissed them off more.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 05:59 am (UTC)(link)
It is possible to not contribute to the wank and still feel anger at what you see, you know? I was just a lurker.

Possibly you don't recall what the ACD fandom was like back then. This was LJ (pre-tumblr) days. ACD fandom was absolutely cruel to SH09 fans. SH09 ended up having to make explicitly Ritchie comms for most of their Holmes stuff to satisfy the other Holmes fans' need for purity. They were all THE BARBARIANS ARE AT THE GATE!! KILL KILL KILL. Jeremy Brett or die!!

It was pretty ugly.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 06:41 am (UTC)(link)
Yeah, no. RDJ Holmes took over all the comms until BBC Sherlock came along. It was the ACD Holmes fans that had to find somewhere else. Cox & Co. in particular was opened up to the new adaptations by the mods and the canon fans were flooded out.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 07:12 am (UTC)(link)
Explain how fans can be "flooded out"? Like there's no posting space left? LJ can't squeeze out one single more byte.

And yet now Cox&Co has all Holmes incarnations co-exiting. Because tags. Because notifications. Because filtering. Tools are there for a reason.

But the other ACD comms started making explicit rules about no Ritchie-verse (and when BBC started, no, BBC.) Because gatekeeping makes people feel precious.


(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 08:04 am (UTC)(link)
Personally, I feel like you're both a bit right. On the one hand, it's definitely true that some of the ACD fans can be pretentious kill-joy snobs. It's also true that fannish space is basically unlimited and filter tags exist for a reason.

That said, I can understand how it could be really frustrating for ACD fans, when a remake that isn't particularly true to the original comes along and instantly attracts a fandom ten times bigger (in terms of volume of fanworks being produced) than the original. And then, right on the heels of that, another remake comes along - this one even less true to the original - and instantly attracts a fandom a hundred times bigger than the original. And now the original fandom is expected to coexist in a shared space with these giant new fandoms flooding through and constantly dwarfing it. I can see how that would be really frustrating, and I say that as someone who's been hugely in the BBC Sherlock fandom for five years, really likes the first Ritchie movie, and could honestly take or leave the original ACD stories.

(Anonymous) 2017-03-13 06:39 pm (UTC)(link)
It's really funny that you think ACD fans - who have existed since the publication of the stories in the late 1800s and are one of the oldest still-active fandoms today - were "flooded out" anywhere. LOL! They were going strong when fandom communication was done by letters through the post. I don't think they're going anywhere. ;)
digitalghosts: valentin_icon (Default)

[personal profile] digitalghosts 2017-03-14 12:48 am (UTC)(link)
I am not sure any adaptation's characterisation is that different - heard RDJ's Holmes and Law's Watson were but ... now I want to see them, Elementary ones, BBC and ACD cas in one 1800s AU. Throw in Poirot, Marple, Tuppence and her bf whose name I forgot.