[ SECRET POST #2734 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2734 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 071 secrets from Secret Submission Post #391.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

I dont think so, because it seems like the OP is complaining about original manga IPs being scanlated and pirated against the authors' wishes, where as the September Scanlations kerfuffle is about doujinshi, the clusterfuck of Eastern-Western fandom relations and intrafandom piracy.

I have more sympathy for doujinshi authors being pirated than licensed manga authors TBH, because they 1. are making little if any money off their creations to begin with, 2. have far less legal recourse against people who repurpose their work without permission, and 3. FFS they're just in it for the love of fandom, and Western fandom has to take advantage of that and take a giant dump all over their wishes in the name of """""spreading the love~""""".

Fencer-x is such a spectacular tool, though, even in a sea of other tools.

[(Anonymous)]

I can't stand her attitude.

If you are going to scanlate doujins against the authors' wishes, then do it, but do not pretend that you're doing it for some high and mighty reason. Just admit it that you're doing it because you're don't give a shit about the authors. It's okay. Most of us are probably selfish assholes too.

[(Anonymous)]

I tried reading her blog once (because I'd seen something mentioned by an artist I follow), and WOW. The passive-aggressive aggressive attitude (including "sweetie/honey" used in patronizing attitudes) made me grit my teeth. What an asshole.

[(Anonymous)]

It's also because Doujinshi artists kind of slide under the radar as long as they aren't too loud/public about their work. But if doujin starts popping up in simple google searches of a series, then the manga-ka or publisher for that series might be more likely to hunt down the doujinshi artist. Basically, it takes the control of that situation out of the doujinshi artist's hands.

[(Anonymous)]

that's blatantly not true when major bookstore chains in japan openly sell doujin in whole sections of the store. but good theory, given the info you had on hand.

[visp]

Eh, isn't like the 50 Shades of Grey lady getting pissed off that people were making fanfiction of her work? I mean, if someone's pirating original content from a small-time artist who relies on that income, that's pretty shitty. However, if you're making your money from infringing on someone else's intellectual property, I don't think you get to be too high and mighty about your own "IP."

[(Anonymous)]

Doujin artists don't dislike theft of their work because it's "infringing on their IP"; doujin artists dislike theft of their work because it's taking control of circulation out of their hands and puts them in legal danger if it becomes too publicized.

[visp]

I'll bet the original writers of those works weren't too fond of the theft of their ideas and others taking control of circulation out of their hands.

[(Anonymous)]

Actually is a pretty accepted thing in Japan? You are just ignorant.

[(Anonymous)]

So it's an acceptable in Japan and creators don't give a fuck, but doujin artists are still constantly worried they'll catch the notice of creators and get in legal trouble?

[(Anonymous)]

It's accepted in Japan BECAUSE it flies under the radar. When it starts catching attention (diverting attention away from the original IP), THEN it becomes problematic for the IP holders.

Western fans don't understand this, because Western fandom has no concept of discretion. (See: All of the fans who tweet fanfic at the actors in their canons.)

[(Anonymous)]

Have there been instances of the fanwork becoming too popular? I'd been interested in hearing about it.

[(Anonymous)]

Where does CLAMP fit into all of this?

They did fanworks/doujinshi and sold them for money. They caught attention, divered attention away from the original IP, and, rather than being considered "problematic", were offered a job. To my knowledge, they weren't ever punished for their fanworks.

They were, however, paid for their fanworks, unlike the poor people on that link.

[(Anonymous)]

Oh please. If the IP holders cared, a half second search of the fandom name on Pixiv will net you links to dozens upon dozens of doujinshi authors and their works. Some series even have official fanbooks that doujinshi authors participate in. The IP holders already know who the doujinshi authors are. The thing that will get them in trouble isn't Westerners scanning their works, it's the authors starting to make significant amounts of money. It's no different than how, say, no one cares that the HP Lexicon exists as a website, but as soon as the owner tried to make an actual money-making book out of it JKR's lawyers jumped in with a LOLNO.

[(Anonymous)]

This, basically. Doujinshi is allowed by IP holders because they view it as being a sort of free advertising for them. Doujinshi artists don't make much (if any) profit off their works; they generally make enough money to cover the printing costs and that's about it. The IP holders don't mind because doujinshi isn't meant to be profitable to the artists, it's done out of a love for the fandom.

It's very common for doujinshi artists to go on to become professional mangaka - see CLAMP, Minekura Kazuya, Tsukishimaya, etc. Most of them were discovered through their doujinshi and then offered a chance to do original work. In fact, Tsukishimaya in particular was a fanartist who did Tales of doujinshi and wound up being asked to do the illustrations for one of the official Tales of novelizations.

The relationship between IP holders and doujinshi artists is a symbiotic one. The only time it would become an issue would be if the doujinshi artists started earning significant money off their fanworks. Otherwise, the IP holders don't care.

[(Anonymous)]

I've never personally believed that argument, not in the age of sites like Pixiv where professional anime industry workers have their own accounts there. The media companies are aware of fanart and they clearly don't give too many fucks, so why are doujin artists so worked up over it?

[(Anonymous)]

Personally, I have little sympathy for the doujin artists. They make little to no money off their work? They're not supposed to. If a doujin artists is making loads of money, they're doing it wrong and will probably be slapped with a big ol' lawsuit by the owners of the original work. Japan is not a magical land with no copyright laws. Doujinshi authors can do what they do because they make little money. That's why they have no legal recourse, because the very existence of doujinshi technically isn't legal. It's like someone trying to sue an American fan who scanned a copy of a fanzine they own. And frankly, if the artists don't want people sharing their work maybe they shouldn't be selling it for money. It's like buying a painting from someone and they tell you that you can put it in your living room, but never take a picture of it and put it on your Facebook feed. Sorry artist, I gave you money for that painting, I'll take a picture if I want to. If the doujinshi artists can't handle that, then they should keep their stuff on Pixiv or pass it around in fandom circles and not put it in shops like Tora no Ana.