[ SECRET POST #2804 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2804 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 064 secrets from Secret Submission Post #401.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 2 - unrelated .gifs ], [ 1 - posted twice ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

This is the quote:

"Editor’s note: The human concept of friend is most nearly duplicated in Vulcan thought by the term t’hy’la, which can also mean brother and lover. Spock’s recollection (from which this chapter has drawn) is that it was a most difficult moment for him since he did indeed consider Kirk to have become his brother. However, because t’hy’la can be used to mean lover, and since Kirk’s and Spock’s friendship was unusually close, this has led to some speculation over whether they had actually indeed become lovers. At our request, Admiral Kirk supplied the following comment on this subject:
“I was never aware of this lovers rumor, although I have been told that Spock encountered it several times. Apparently he had always dismissed it with his characteristic lifting of his right eyebrow which usually connoted some combination of surprise, disbelief, and/or annoyance. As for myself, although I have no moral or other objections to physical love in any of its many Earthly, alien, and mixed forms, I have always found my best gratification in that creature woman. Also, I would dislike being thought of as so foolish that I would select a love partner who came into sexual heat only once every seven years.”"

But it just seems really odd to me how it's phrased. Like the use of "best." Why not "only" if Roddenberry wanted to suggest that Kirk only liked women? Moreover, it doesn't seem as though Vulcans were written as ONLY coming into sexual heat once every seven years.

I guess I don't see why he wouldn't just have Kirk say flat-out, "No, we're not lovers." Why even bring up the concept of t'hy'la in the first place and then IN THE TEXT compare their relationship to the fires of Pon Farr and then have Kirk say that he gets "best gratification" from women. It's just baffling to me to think that he saw this as a way of dissuading the shippers.

[(Anonymous)]

Was Roddenberry really leaving cryptic, to-be-decoded messages to K/S shippers though?

[(Anonymous)]

No -- I don't think it was for K/S shippers. I think it was there to make sure that if anyone had an issue with the Kirk/Spock relationship and him making the pon farr comparisons and then including the lover thing, he could point to that and let the reader come to their own conclusion.

Granted, maybe it IS K/S shippers reading too much into it, but it just seems like a TON of work to put in to dissuade the shippers and it's SO very likely to backfire. I mean, creating a specific word to describe their relationship and then including the definition of lover? Yeah…

Plus there's other things that just strike me as…well…interesting considering the climate at the time the book was released. The use of San Francisco. The rainbow on the cover. How, in the author's preface, Roddenberry makes it a point to emphasize love as truth.

Then there's the comparisons between Kirk and Spock and Ilia and Captain Decker (their reunions…) and Ilia and Decker are definitely romantically inclined. Ilia bears striking similarities to Spock while Decker is a Captain like Kirk was and they certainly share attributes as well.

I just have a hard time believing he wrote it to dissuade K/S given how it's tied into the story and given the events surrounding the release of the book.

[(Anonymous)]

DA
But it just seems really odd to me how it's phrased. Like the use of "best." Why not "only" if Roddenberry wanted to suggest that Kirk only liked women? Moreover, it doesn't seem as though Vulcans were written as ONLY coming into sexual heat once every seven years.

Kirk's tone was supposed to be lighthearted and not defensive, though
like he didn't want to say something against the guys or vulcans but still reiterated that females are his passion

I guess I don't see why he wouldn't just have Kirk say flat-out, "No, we're not lovers."

some people didn't say 'I disagree with you' here but reading the thread you can tell when someone doesn't agree with every point you made.
the beauty of communication is that you can convey a concept or express an opinion beyond the 'yes' and 'no' s and get the point come across anyway.