Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2007-12-31 05:38 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2007-12-31 05:38 pm
[ SECRET POST #360 ]
⌈ Secret Post #360 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
1.
__________________________________________________
2.
__________________________________________________
3.
__________________________________________________
4.
__________________________________________________
5.
__________________________________________________
6.
__________________________________________________
7.
__________________________________________________
8. [ repeat ]
__________________________________________________
9.
__________________________________________________
10.
__________________________________________________
11.
__________________________________________________
12.
__________________________________________________
13.
__________________________________________________
14.
__________________________________________________
15.
__________________________________________________
16.
__________________________________________________
17.
__________________________________________________
18.
__________________________________________________
19.
__________________________________________________
20.
__________________________________________________
21.
__________________________________________________
22.
__________________________________________________
23.
__________________________________________________
24.
__________________________________________________
25.
__________________________________________________
26.
__________________________________________________
27.
__________________________________________________
28.
__________________________________________________
29.
__________________________________________________
30.
__________________________________________________
31.
__________________________________________________
32. [ repeat ]
__________________________________________________
33.
__________________________________________________
34.
__________________________________________________
35.
__________________________________________________
36.
__________________________________________________
37.
__________________________________________________
38.
__________________________________________________
39.
__________________________________________________
40.
__________________________________________________
41.
__________________________________________________
Notes:
Secrets Left to Post: 08 pages, 192 secrets from Secret Submission Post #052.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 linked back to the page ] broken links, [ 1 2 ] not!secrets, [ 1? 2? ] not!fandom, [ 1 2 3 ] repeats, [ 1 ] probably not for real.
Next Secret Post: Tomorrow, Tuesday, January 1st, 2008.
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
Re: 16
Regret is for weaklings!I agree with you. Or rather, you managed to say what I was thinking in a way that is coherent - something I'm not good at, ever. I grew up in Vermont, which prides itself on being crazily left-wing -- and I definitely grew up noticing a sort of... association. "Excessive religiousness is bad, and all Christians are excessive." And like you said, since the majority of LJ is scientifically proven to be feminist lesbians (I kid, I kid), and since Christianity is so prevalent and loud - I think it's a matter of, "these people here are against the things I believe in; they are Christian and say it's a religious sin; therefore all Christians must be like this."
Or... something.
I have noticed a trend, though - in the news, entertainment, whatever. Denouncing Judaism? Major no-no; people get called on for being anti-Semitic, have to make public apologies, etc. Bash Islam? You're immediately corrected because it's a good religion taken out of hand by a few extremists, etc.
Bash Christianity? More power to you. I'm of course being extremely general in saying this, but it does bug me. Part of it, I almost think, is political - especially in the US (The conservative right are Christian by and large, etc).
Re: 16
I think the Islam bashing part is more economics than anything. You don't want to piss off the people who have your oil.
Edit: Oops, forgot this part. I think the reason it's become increasingly easier for people to bash Christianity without much consequence is because of television. Flip channels on any given day of the week and you'll probably find a televangelist somewhere preaching hellfire and brimstone. People are used to discounting television programs as good entertainment and works of fiction, except for maybe the news. It puts Christianity out there as a topic of conversation on par with what happened on your favorite soap opera or reality show. People have no trouble bashing it because they don't really view it as real, as something that holds great importance to real people, as a life changing event. I've never flipped channels and come across a sermon at a synagogue or mosque. Maybe I just don't catch those channels.
Re: 16
I feel dread at starting a sentence in this way, but, "After 9/11," there was a rash of anti-Muslim feeling. And it was retarded, and immediately people stepped in to basically point out that fact - because not every Islamic person, obviously, is a terrorist - not every German is a nazi, to indirectly quote another comment a few pages back.
But then there's also the sentiment - albeit a much quieter one - that every Christian is a close-minded fool. It's obviously on a lesser scale - no one is accusing them of genocide - and probably because it's more subtle, it's easier to get away with.
I think the reason it's become increasingly easier for people to bash Christianity without much consequence is because of television.
I think you're exactly right! I think it's also... Christianity is so prevalent, too, that it becomes easier to spot the extremists and fanatics. Percentage-wise in the US at least, there aren't nearly as many people of any other religion - and television loves that sort of thing, crazy loud people.
Re: 16
I guess the main detractor of Christianity is, not that they're all close-minded fools, but that the loudest ones are(like you said, crazy loud people); and that leads into a whole other argument on hypocrisy. The smart, sensible Christians that actually *gasp* follow the tenets of their faith are too busy doing God's work to bother boisterously making fools of themselves in public. A true Christian generally won't have to tell you that he is one; you'll see it by his actions. At least, that's what they told me when I still went to church.
Re: 16
But, if it's the biggest target, wouldn't it make it Target?
I kid, I kid. I've been reading all the responses on the threadlet here, and it's been interesting, and I generally agree with the conversation going on here. I think that the western world, particularly the US has had a well established "cultural Christianity." It doesn't always synch up with "true Christianity" (which, in my opinion on the entire history of the world, has rarely been popular). Nevermind that "Christians" are constantly arguing about what constitutes "true Christianity" - think about it. What did we just go through, the holiday where everybody gets presents?
It seems perfectly acceptable for people to talk about the Baby Jesus right around then, and people's Nativity yard displays are not deemed offensive. (I won't get into inflatable Santa Claus on a motorcycle....)
Then it's just back to "Ew, Christianity. Keep it in the closet!" the rest of the year.
I think perhaps it's "okay" to bash Christians because it is seen as the "religion of the establisment" (regardless of the actual truth of that). Other religions? They are minority, they are exotic. And yes, large numbers of people belonging to them fuel our SUVs. (Though I don wonder if the OP of the secret had been Muslim, if people on the thread would have screamed "terrorist" at him/her).
I honestly don't think people credit (historical) Christianity enough for Western open-mindedness. I was watching programs the other day about ancient Rome and the ancient world and, when Christianity hit it brought all kinds of radical ideas about equality, about masters and slaves being equal, and yes, women being the spiritual equals of men. (I was always taught that the "submit to your husband thing" went along with "husbands love your wives" as in - an EQUAL submission out of love, and of course, there's the verse about there being "no slave or free, no male or female...")
I think, because "cultural Christianity" has become the "establisment" and tied up with those loud politically-ambitious people, most people have forgotten what true Christianity is about, and the equity and tolerance inherent in the religion.
Though, I do come from a biased view, being a Christian myself, so I understand if people want to disregard everything I've just said.
Re: 16
It seems in today's society, there is a movement of nice, generally unobtrusive Christians like yourself to specify that despite the crazy zealots of both old and modern day, your religion and its teachings are ultimately one of tolerance and love.
I must ask you: How do you reconcile that with the rather violent lessons of the Old Testament? From my understanding, all of God's word is divine law. I also understand that according to the New Testament, God does indeed forgive sins as long as one follows a life of Christ---and by extension divine law. Does one simply exclude the instructions to burn down neighbor villages with heathen presence? How does that work?
Don't misunderstand me; I think the peaceful, mostly keep-it-to-yourself Christian movement is an excellent one, but I still have to ask.
Re: 16
Generally, modern Christians live by the New Testament. The Old Testament is largely considered "for another time," I guess.
I'm not even sure I'm the one to ask. I'm no theology student, and, as I've said above, I haven't actually been to church in over a year. (This stemming from personal social anxiety and a general unsuress about the American church's place in politics). These kind of questions might be better asked of a "better" Christian. *Grin.*
Re: 16
Re: 16
Target-*snerk*Well, I did my best to follow Christianity for a while before trying to seek my own path, and I just think it leads to more comprehensive discussions on the theology and actuality of it. Any good debater has heard the phrase "Know your material/topic". I think if someone is unfamiliar with a subject then they have no business trying to say whether it is good or bad. The fact that you are a Christian yourself, having a rational discussion about Christianity, actually makes me more inclined to listen to you.
You did bring up a very good point that had slipped my mind when writing my response above. "Cultural Christianity" and "establishment" indeed. I remember watching some program, I can't remember what it was, sadly; a child was asked if they were Christian, and their response was "I'm American". Even if Christianity is the prevalent religion of the U.S., it would be a sad state of affairs if Americans were all to claim Christianity by 'default', and be entirely unaware of what they are claiming affiliation with.
Actually, that brings me back to your earlier point about 'historical' Christianity. I think you're absolutely right, but that is because I am familiar with the source material. The people who bash Christianity as a national past-time just pick and choose which scriptures to quote based on which ones will make them seem right, and disregard the ones that would prove them wrong.
I think the cornerstone of the problem is that the loudest ones claiming to be Christian don't actually follow their faith, and of course this will give the people who actually do a bad name.
Re: 16
I cringe whenever G.W. Bush mentions Christianity.
Re: 16
I cringe whenever someone mentions G.W. Bush lolRe: 16
Re: 16
Re: 16
Reading this was a delight.
Re: 16
When I bother to read the threads, your name usually catches my attention because it seems you always have something interesting to say, but I'm kind of new to the comm so I wasn't really comfortable butting in ^^;;
Re: 16
Gad;jfdskfjd, feel free to butt in all you want! I admire more than anything the ability to analyze and put in concise and coherent terms truly insightful observations.
Re: 16