fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2995 ]

[ SECRET POST #2995 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2995 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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[Twin Peaks]

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[Big Hero 6]

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[WWE/NXT]

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[Chris Barrie (Red Dwarf)]

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[Person of Interest]

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[Legend of Korra]

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[Final Fantasy X]

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[Xenoblade Chronicles]

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[Jeremy Clarkson from Top Gear]

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[Paul Darrow]

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[Gore Vidal]

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[South Park]

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[Ursula K. LeGuin, Earthsea series]

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20.

[Galavant]

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[A Goofy Movie]

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22.

[Mockingjay]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 079 secrets from Secret Submission Post #428.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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In case anyone is wondering, I'm referring to this: http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/dc-comics-cancels-batgirl-joker-variant-at-artists-request

I'm feeling a little confused and alienated today because I kinda liked that cover, but literally every reasonable person I know hated it, and the only people who didn't, seem to be me and assholes.

I even read "The Killing Joke" and am aware of the fridging and the awful implications, and I *still* don't think the cover was that bad. I thought it was disturbing and effective. I'm ultimately okay with them pulling it, especially since the Batgirl writers and the artist himself spoke out, but...I don't know. I'm a feminist and I hate the Joker and I still thought the outrage was a little OTT. I'm honestly questioning myself now.

Idk I guess I just wanted to say it. Anyone else been following this?

I'm not following the particular controversy but while the style is nice the cover has the kind of creepy connotations about the comics content that would have me decide not to buy that particular issue*. I can see how it would explode and feed back on itself.

*if I wasn't still in a grumpy snit / strike over batwoman

As a long time DC reader, from what I've seen Barbara fans are sick of the Killing Joke constantly brought up when it comes to her character. DC seems to think that Babs' most iconic moment was when she was stripped, tied up, and shot in the spine by the Joker. She wasn't even written as Batgirl at the moment, but as Jim Gordon's daughter.
It's been referenced over and over in DC's comics. This isn't the first time.

This.

If they'd kept her in the damn chair it'd be one thing, but the whole lets reference the event she got magically better from is just one great big slam in the face to their disabled and wheelchair using fans. DC don't roll with no crips, know what I'm saying.

Let's not lie, The Killing Joke is a hell of a good story. Moore and Bolland at the height of their powers, pulling off the impossible by giving the Joker a human dimension without making him the least bit sympathetic, and culminating with that great Joker Manifesto at the end, and Batman's untoppable, perfect comeback to it. It's REALLY good.

But for fucksake, Barbara's been in a few other fucking stories, you know? I miss her as Oracle. Maybe it's just because that's who she was when I was a teenager, but man, she was cool as hell.

I miss Oracle so, so much.

Re: That Batgirl cover controversy

(Anonymous) - 2015-03-18 15:27 (UTC) - Expand

Re: That Batgirl cover controversy

(Anonymous) - 2015-03-18 19:17 (UTC) - Expand

I haven't been in comics for a long time so I don't know the current controversies but it seems okay to me too. It seems like something the Joker would do and gives the menace that goes with the character (or went with him at some point of his run).

It is all to do with context. The cover on its own is a disturbing piece of art, and if the Batgirl book was still part of the dark and gritty Batverse of a few years ago it would be, well within the paradigm of the series (personally wouldn't like it, but it would fit).

However, the current Batgirl book is upbeat and peppy. That cover is wildly out of character both for the current characterization of batgirl and the general tone of the book Not to mention the Batgirl book has gone through rather a rough patch with its reboot and people hurling insults left, right, and center at the non-traditional fans who do not buy from traditional comic book stores. That cover, in that context, seems like it is joining in with some of those threats and insults. It also does not fit the current DC interpretation of the Joker, who is even darker and more vicious even than during The Killing Joke itself.

It is all about the context of the comic, the newer fanbase that DC has been trying to cultivate and who have grown around the new version of the comic, the recent history of how some of the more traditionalist fans have behaved, and of course how it looks with an even more sadistic Joker in the Batbooks as a whole.

Taken on its own, the cover is a disturbing piece of art, but that is all. However comic covers cannot exist on their own and must exist within the context of the comic itself. That context does match the cover's tone, no matter how well intentioned it was in trying to celebrate the past. Or as they said to Mary, Queen of Scot's, axeman; nice idea but shame about the execution.

Yeah, I get why it struck a nerve. At the same time it's just a cover, and a variant at that. So it was an homage to the killing Joke, and now folk are supposed to pretend that it wasn't an iconic comic that artists would pull imagery from? Sure, tasteless events happened in it, but it's always going to be part of the history no matter how many times canon gets a reboot because people remember and talk about. And that's okay. It's not like a cover will influence how Batgirl is in the actual ongoing jfc.

Eh, I think the reaction is really a mix of things. Part of it is, as someone else mentioned, people being sick that being referenced with regards to Babs, or the fact that's completely different from the tone of the current series, and that the artist didn't want it to be the cover [and possible the writers...? I'm a little fuzzy about them].

The art's good, but it makes her a victim rather than a hero. It's not a "How will our hero get out of this?" image, but a "Who will save this helpless, crying girl?" image. The distinction doesn't have to be large, but it's very visible.

This is even more true considering that Barbara was the helpless female victim in the Killing Joke.

not "the" helpless female, etc. She was merely "A" helpless female, etc. She wasn't a major part of the arc, she was incidental and collateral damage.

Re: That Batgirl cover controversy

(Anonymous) - 2015-03-18 19:18 (UTC) - Expand

I'd never heard of this but jesus fucking christ, that is horrifying.

who the fuck thought that that cover was ever ok?

40 year old nerds who were teens in the 80s, and scummy teens who are jealous of the relative higher levels of privilege male teens of the 80s used to have.

Cute, but in reality, it's way better to be a nerdy teen today than it was in the 80s. Physical abuse is no longer openly condoned by the school system, for one thing. Kids today just don't get beaten up, duct-taped to things, swirlied, or otherwise physically tortured the way they used to.

The world doesn't actually function in terms of your blinkered notion of privilege.

That's the first time I've seen that image, and my immediate reaction is that it's absolutely and obviously not okay.

I'm sort of torn on it.

On one hand I absolutely understand the criticism, and that Batgirl represents a strong heroine, not a victim.

On the other hand, does this mean we cannot show female heroes ever being beaten,captured, tortured, threatened...? That would not be something I would applaud.

Frankly I'd sort of have to see the content, and how the cover related to it (which I haven't).

The cover has no relation to the story within the current comics.

Well then that sucks.

It's pretty completely at odds tone-wise. The current comics are pretty happy and up beat so this cover [and the events it references] are pretty far in the opposite direction tone wise.

Right, then I can see why people are pissed off.

Wow. The Batman family of comics have a long history of creepy semi-horror imagery. Objecting to this is like objecting to visible chrome on the cover of Low Rider.

I guess DC really is trying to do something different with Babsgirl.

Yes. Yes, DC has being trying something very different for Batgirl. I'm glad you agree it is inappropriate.

ayrt

(Anonymous) - 2015-03-19 05:06 (UTC) - Expand

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