fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #385 ]

[ SECRET POST #385 ]

⌈ Secret Post #385 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Last day to submit for next week!!

...holy crap #36, I love you XDDDD

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 00 secrets from Secret Submission Post #055.
Secrets Not Posted: 0 broken links, [ 1 2 ] not!secrets, 0 not!fandom, [ 1 2 3 ] repeats.
Next Secret Post: Tomorrow, Saturday, January 26th, 2008.
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

29. What is it with all these secrets about people "loosing" respect for other people? You know, if you want people to respect you, you should learn to fucking spell.

33. I'd say yes, too. The whole incest taboo is an odd one. The biggest actual, practical problem would be the offspring, and they've taken all the necessary precautions, so... what's the big deal? (Anybody else hear about that couple who got married and then discovered they were twins separated at birth? Totally proves that the incest taboo is entirely a socially constructed thing. Screw "morality" based in evolution and biology XD)

37. Ha. No further mention of this movie! Because... this random anonymous person doesn't like it! Yes, yes, we'll definitely obey that one... (It's not even out yet over here wtf...)

You're slandering my secret, you know. Ah, me! We anonymice, we don't get no respect these days.

Whoops. That'll be 26.

Ha. I need to sleep.

You are pardoned. Go forth and sleep.

;)

How embarrassing... XD (It's nearly 2am)

Yay for Greenwich Mean Time!

Also, if you have reply alerts turned on, then chances are you know my LJ identity. Bugger. *hides from the angry Miyazaki fans*

I have them turned on, but you're still anonymous...

I must have deleted my earlier mistake before the LJ tech could dispatch a message. It's so easy to slip up when tonight is tomorrow morning. Yay. I'm still a fathead, but at least I'm an anonymous fathead.

Anonymous fatheads are the best kind?

For the fatheads, yes - for everyone else, no. As is easily demonstrated by anonymous hate memes.

(And I did it again. *head meets wall* I'm a mouse with a deathwish.)

Ha... if you hadn't said, I would have assumed I was talking to two separate people :P

Re: OP/29

(Anonymous) - 2008-01-26 02:17 (UTC) - Expand

33. Those precautions can fail, you know. They fail LOTS.

33. I think it'd depend...while most cultures have an incest taboo, the degree of acceptability varies (like whether first cousins marrying is acceptable or not). So unless the twins were identical (in which case I wonder how they didn't figure it out sooner!) I think it's still possible for the taboo to be rooted in biology and the couple in question might have been dissimilar enough because of the different genes they inherited that they didn't register any aversion.

Hmm I don't really buy that. (I'm assuming they weren't, because - yeah... how slow can you be? XD) I guess you can't properly and definitively prove it either way, though.

No doubt first cousins marrying and such is a bad idea, though... ~~Have you seen the royal family? XD~~

I wish I could remember what I was reading the other week... some really interesting theory stuff about exchange of property (and included in that, of women) as a way of establishing kinship networks in primitive societies providing a possible basis for the taboo. Not sure I buy that, either, but it was interesting reading.

I just remember reading a few years back an article about how when given scents from people to sniff, people found more pleasing the samples that were taken from people that were more genetically dissimilar. (...it sounds like one of the weirdest experiments to participate in. XD)

I tried google to see if I could find the articles, but all I found was this article (http://seedmagazine.com/news/2006/09/scent_of_family_guides_girls_m.php) about girls seeming to have an aversion to their dad's scent and the presence of a dad delaying the onset of the daughters' puberty.

I do think specific taboos, like "no, you should never marry your first cousin/second cousin/aunt/uncle/whatever" are determined by society (my biology teacher explained once that the royal families' troubles with hemophilia weren't due to intermarriage, since it only popped up in the men), but I also think there is a biological cause behind it.

I think I heard about that. I also read somewhere (which is a bit weird) that girls are more likely to be attracted to men who share characteristics with their fathers. Which made me go o.O

Sure there'll be a biological reason not to do something (like this), but I'm not sure about slapping a big "morality" label on it.

I think it's still possible for the taboo to be rooted in biology and the couple in question might have been dissimilar enough because of the different genes they inherited that they didn't register any aversion.

I think it's the other way around. Sexual attraction between relatives who were separated at birth and reunited is extremely common, much more than people realise. The experts who've studied the phenomenon seem to think it's the similarity between the two that causes the fascination. Here's (http://www.guardian.co.uk/weekend/story/0,3605,956454,00.html) a pretty in-depth article about it, if you're interested.

That's a pretty interesting article; I hadn't heard of GSA before. Thanks for the link.

I totally understand what you're saying regarding incest. I don't think it is inherently bad, when genetics and biological factors are removed.

However, I believe that all parties involved in any sort of sexual relationship should be able to consent. The problem is that, while in theory, sibling/sibling relationships can be consensual (I don't think parent/child can ever be) it becomes kind of tough, in real life, to actually find a situation where such a consensual, healthy relationship could actually exist. When a sibling/sibling relationship exists, it tends to indicate that the children think the only valid method of expressing love is through sex (which is usually indicative of sexual abuse by the parents). With that sort of psychological damage, it probably is a REALLY bad idea for those siblings to get together.

Plus, among siblings, age differences tend to matter a lot more than they would in normal relationships. An older sibling would tend to have an unfair psychological position of power that would negate consent the vast majority of the time.

(It's a whole different game when you get into the separated-at-birth, raised in different families thing, though.)

Sorry, tl;dr. I suck. :(

You're right, totally. I'm not here saying "Incest is great!" (which is what one unfortunate member of my writing class declared the other day... he meant as a plot device in fiction, but we were still like LOLWHAT?), just that in the specific scenario described in the secret, there doesn't seem to be a moral basis for them to refrain from a sexual relationship. There are other reasons not to (as someone else said, methods of contraception may fail, and then you've got kids with a higher probability of birth defects, plus the social stigma, and the rest of the family to deal with...), but... yeah.

Oh, okay then. I totally agree with you :D

33. Totally proves that the incest taboo is entirely a socially constructed thing.

No. No, it doesn't. Google "imprinting" or "Westermarck effect."

Westermarck effect is an effect of raising and social conditioning. Look up genetic similarity attraction, while you're at it.

Uh, not really. While imprinting and the Westermarck effect have social repercussions, their impetus is likely to be an inherent or instinctual mechanism in the brain... y'know, being that imprinting has been observed in animals like apes and chimps and ducks and so on. It's not merely a social construct.

GSA tends to occur when genetically related individuals have been raised separately.

Screw "morality" based in evolution and biology XD

Uhm...not really? Sure, not everything we, as humans, do can be purely seen from a biological standpoint, but a lot can and is.

Edited 2008-01-26 03:07 (UTC)

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #385 ]

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