Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
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fandomsecrets2015-08-28 07:03 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2015-08-28 07:03 pm
[ SECRET POST #3159 ]
⌈ Secret Post #3159 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
01.
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02.
[Knights Errant]
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03.
[HeadOn]
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04.
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05.
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06. [SPOILERS for Tales of the Abyss]
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07. [WARNING for rape]
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08. [WARNING for sexual assault/harassment]
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09. [WARNING for child sexual abuse]
Notes:
Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #451.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
Re: Anyone seen the Hannibal finale? [spoilers obviously]
And I find this hilarious because I actually read said fic and was thinking, "Oh, this is great!" before I realized it was yours. I had bookmarked it and everything, so when I read this comment I went, "...Wait, was that the Molly fic?" then of course it had been. I'll try to leave a comment on it later, but know that it was beautiful and I encourage any other Hannibal fic you feel up to writing!
but in retrospect, it just looks like an obvious ending
I think dark!Will is obvious in a not-so-pleasant way, but the alternative would have been following the canon more closely and maybe having Molly shoot Dolarhyde or Hannibal staying in jail (or being put back there by Will) and I don't feel like that would be true to this version of the show, or frankly interesting. I like that Fuller wants to keep us on our toes; this was not the 'easy' way out for him, but imo it was the right one.
Will has been sullied for a long time, but I think we're so used to 'right' and 'good' triumphing in the end (even that culminates in murder suicide) that it's hard to consider that going bad might be someone's ending.
Yea, I think you have a point there; people want good to overcome and Will to get better instead of worse. That's an understandable and common way to feel, but when it comes down to it Will not being able to escape his demons, not being able to break the cycle of his fucked up and abusive relationship with Hannibal in such a way that would allow him to keep living his 'peaceful' existence is something that I honestly feel is more realistic. More depressing for sure, but this show has always been dark, you have to go into it expecting that, and I'm glad they kept with it to the end because it feels like a natural progression.
(Though apparently no one has a problem sullying Clarice in that way (Argentina). Then again, that ending for her wasn't in the movie, and the books aren't as widespread.)
I did wonder about that! Like I said, I've listened to some Hannibal podcasts and even the people who have read the books don't usually comment on the Clarice ending. (One did, but the others either forgot it, ignored it, or didn't like it.)
Hannibal would probably respect him for that, though, especially if Will helped break him out later.
Hannibal would definitely respect him for that, but given his reaction to Will's actions in the past I also think it would hurt. If Will is truly going to stay with Hannibal I could imagine Will doing the same, allowing himself to be caught and Hannibal to get away. I mean...again with the "They know" phone call. (Again, Will could help him escape, but you KNOW if Will was caught Hannibal would come for him.)
It's horrible that I actually want him on the loose.
So many things about this show are horrible and yet we love them. I feel this way about Hannibal himself, but I've got to give Fuller and Mads all the credit for making him more than simply 'the devil'. Yes he's an atrocious human being, but he's not just that. And I'll admit, his relationship with Will makes him seem a bit more 'human' and sympathetic. (Again, as bizarre as that is, given all the fucking terrible shit he's done to Will. Something Fuller said about crying and feeling bad for Hannibal when writing the s2 finale comes to mind.)
This fucking show.
It's like once he has nothing left to pretend about, the civilized gloves come off.
Those are some of my favorite Hannibal moments. Whispering "He's in the pantry" in the s2 finale, and all his cannibalism jokes that flew over everyone's heads for so long. If he wasn't so snarky we probably wouldn't be as drawn to his character.
Re: Anyone seen the Hannibal finale? [spoilers obviously]
Aw, thank you! I ended up wanting to do a scene of someone (who wasn't Hannibal and who Will wasn't there to kill) looking at Will from the outside, and Molly seemed like the most likely person for that, lol. Also, I'm still unsure how dark I see Will (as in, dark, or reeeeeally dark), and having him be enigmatic and just sort there was a good way not to delve into that, lol. Actually, if I ever try writing my S4 fic idea, this could still be a scene in it.
I did wonder about that! Like I said, I've listened to some Hannibal podcasts and even the people who have read the books don't usually comment on the Clarice ending. (One did, but the others either forgot it, ignored it, or didn't like it.)
I'm going to have to read the Hannibal book someday, just to see how that played out. It feels odd for Clarice to run away with Hannibal because she was so morally upstanding. Will (show Will, at least), not so much.
Yes he's an atrocious human being, but he's not just that. And I'll admit, his relationship with Will makes him seem a bit more 'human' and sympathetic. (Again, as bizarre as that is, given all the fucking terrible shit he's done to Will.
The whole show is a study in contradictions, but it's just so well done. Because if Hannibal was never anything but the bad baddie over here, cackling to himself, we wouldn't find him so compelling. It's that he has these desires for connection, and even weaknesses, that make him interesting. And of course, it's interesting to see how his 'love' plays out, because it definitely doesn't take the typical route of 'the one I love is the one I'm different to, the one I'd never hurt.' And speaking of contradictions, I still can't get over how the killing of Dolarhyde was filmed. It was actually beautiful. It was plenty gory, but wasn't gory like other gore on the show, like eye gouging or face eating or meat wings. It was actually beautiful, and I have no idea how they pulled that off.
Whispering "He's in the pantry" in the s2 finale, and all his cannibalism jokes that flew over everyone's heads for so long.
"In the pantry." (Where I keep all my food) lol.
Re: Anyone seen the Hannibal finale? [spoilers obviously]
Oh, Molly is the best for that. While I'm satisfied with what we got in the show (and think it makes sense that past a certain point, Will might not see or talk to Molly again; he might want to spare her the pain of the upcoming 'separation', it might be best to leave her with mostly positive memories of him), I definitely wouldn't mind getting some deleted scenes with her. Or just one. I wish fandom would do more Molly/Will interaction. (And not the "Hannibal goes to kill Molly" kind, because there's no way even dark!Will would be okay with that, and Hannibal would not want to anger Will in that way. I doubt he would even broach the subject; he has Will, what does he need to mess with Molly for?)
So yea, if you write that fic I'll be all over it! It's a nice premise.
It feels odd for Clarice to run away with Hannibal because she was so morally upstanding.
I think that's the exact problem people have with it; they feel it to be OOC. And I think she might be drugged by Hannibal through at least some of it, so I'm not sure how much agency she has through that, but a lot of people see to have the same problem with Will and Hannibal...they see Will as too good to join up with him. I won't deny that Will has a lot of goodness in him, but s3 Will is far from s1 Will; there's goodness, but there's definitely not only goodness. (Sometimes I wonder if people try to ignore all the darkness in Will because they love him so much and like Will, don't want to admit it's there.)
Because if Hannibal was never anything but the bad baddie over here, cackling to himself, we wouldn't find him so compelling.
And this is why despite Hannibal being awful, he's one of the villains that I like the most. I can acknowledged that he's awful, but he's so much more than that. Villains are often so one-note and boring, and Hannibal is the exact opposite. He has an odd, sick kind of charm distinctly his own.
because it definitely doesn't take the typical route of 'the one I love is the one I'm different to, the one I'd never hurt.'
I guess this is why some people can't ship Hannibal/Will and don't like the ending, because they aren't okay with how fucked up they are and how 'poorly' (there's no word for how horrible some of the things Hannibal does to Will are) Hannibal treats him. Some of those people might be more okay with it if Hannibal DID treat Will differently; if he would never hurt him. That's not how Hannibal is though, and not how Hannibal sees his treatment of Will.
It was actually beautiful.
This is one of those things you have to be there for. Trying to explain how two men ganging up to murder a third in such a bloody, violent death ballet is beautiful would most likely make you sound unstable and demented, lmao. It IS though; the shooting, the music, how intimate it is. It's a culmination of Hannibal and Will's entire relationship and Will's struggle, and it's presented in the most primal, natural way possible. God, the song was so perfect for that scene; I've listened to it so much since the finale and can't get over how absolutely breathtaking the entire last scene was. The presentation is incredible.
Re: Anyone seen the Hannibal finale? [spoilers obviously]
Yeah, I've never read the book, so I'm not 100% sure either. I know he drugs her for the dinner with Krendler, and he drugs her and tries to get her to actually be Mischa or something, but even drugged, she tells him hell no to that. Then they leave together? But at the end, Barney sees them together in Argentina. Though obviously we have no idea of how influenced she is by outside things like drugs then. Either way, if she's drugged, it's a bad ending for her, or if she's there willingly, that just seems like a complete contradiction of her whole character. Whereas with Will, I definitely see a lot of evidence for it waaaaay before the finale. His moral fiber has been sliding for a while.
(Sometimes I wonder if people try to ignore all the darkness in Will because they love him so much and like Will, don't want to admit it's there.)
I think that could be part of it? It's easy to see him as the 'good' to Hannibal's bad, and if you had asked me before this season, I would have said that anything dark that Will did wasn't *really* him or was just him playing the game (and hating it, not getting any enjoyment out of it). However, now? Oh yeah, Will is really having a battle with himself, and it's a really hard fight.
because they aren't okay with how fucked up they are and how 'poorly' (there's no word for how horrible some of the things Hannibal does to Will are) Hannibal treats him
Hannibal/Will officially wins Most Fucked Up Ship award. How can anyone else even compete. At first, it's one sided abusive, but now I'd say it's equally abusive, as Will has become Hannibal's equal and trying to murder each other seems just another day in the life. In S1, it really was 'poor Will!' Now, I don't really feel sorry for Will, because he's just as bad. The fact that that makes them perfect for each other is just wrong, but there you go.
Re: Anyone seen the Hannibal finale? [spoilers obviously]
Were they sleeping together too? Because if so, wow, that's yet another level of fucked up.
and if you had asked me before this season, I would have said that anything dark that Will did wasn't *really* him or was just him playing the game (and hating it, not getting any enjoyment out of it
For me, I've always shipped Hannibal/Will but never wanted Will to go dark before this season. The only way I could run with the ship was if Will was unaware of Hannibal's actions, or if he didn't participate in them and still hated Hannibal for it, despite caring about him anyway. (You know, canon.) A lot changed in the last season. I feel like there was plenty of darkness in Will before S3, but it wasn't as apparent until the rewatch. Now I truly believe this show is much better in one go, because otherwise there's so many things to miss. (And in S3...well, that's a whole other story.)
Hannibal/Will officially wins Most Fucked Up Ship award.
I've thought this so many times, lol. Most my ships are fluffy, or if not fluffy, at least relatively happy despite their circumstances; they generally treat each other very well. Hannibal/Will is the opposite of what I'm usually into, but I think that's what fascinates me about them so much. They shouldn't work, but somehow they do. (Which is the worst thing!)
Now, I don't really feel sorry for Will
I probably shouldn't feel sorry for Will, but then again I felt sorry for Hannibal when Will 'broke up' with him, so it still happens despite what they deserve. (Hannibal deserves a long and painful death, and yet I still don't want him to die, etc.) I blame Bryan Fuller for making such complex characters, and Hugh and Mads for being superb actors that draw emotion out of me that I should not be feeling.