[ SECRET POST #3217 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3217 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 064 secrets from Secret Submission Post #460.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[mimi-sardinia.livejournal.com]

And I don't see why a belief in evolution is needed when getting flu shots. It's not like you have to do a written exam before a doctor will give the shot to you.

[(Anonymous)]

Isn't it cherrypicking science? Yeah sure you're eligible for flu shots whatever you believe. But if you only believe in the science that doesn't conflict with your religion, you're missing the point of how science works. The same methodology is applied across the board; here we have natural selection, here we have black holes, here we have Gondwana, here we have electrical nerve signals, here we have the uncertainty principle. Don't like how any of it works? Nix that, edit this, aaaah now my reality is more comfortable, because for me, solid reality we can observe and deduce is subservient to faith except where I'm lazy and don't like getting sick in winter or having to walk/swim to London. Science is 99.99999% sure of these theories using the scientific method to correlate and test with reality, and we sure wouldn't have the technology based on these theories if we weren't willing to put our lives on the line for them, but sure, strange Creationist religious types, go ahead and just -decide- that sometimes the reliability of the scientific method is complete and utter bunkum because it hurts my intellectually lazy brain too much, before I climb into my oversized computerized 8-cylinder SUV.

[mimi-sardinia.livejournal.com]

I don't care if your brain is hurt. People are still going to get flu shots if they wish to.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm sorry you lack reading comprehension.

[mimi-sardinia.livejournal.com]

I'm sorry you can't write clearly.

I still don't see why this is even important anyway.

[feotakahari]

But if you don't believe in evolution, why would you get a new flu shot every year? http://m.livescience.com/16433-everyday-evolution-flu-shots.html

[mimi-sardinia.livejournal.com]

Uhh... I did not see any conclusive reason why believing we descended from apes has anything to with bacterial mutation in that article.

The simple fact is, when I go to the doctor to get a flu shot, I'm not thinking about evolution. I'm thinking about not having the flu and puking up my guts this year (because that what happens when I get the flu).

I still wonder, do people constantly think "This is what evolution does" to every single aspect of their life? Like "Oh, I woke up! Evolution at work!", "Oh, I have to make breakfast! That's evolution!", "Oh, I have to go to work! Evolution!". Because I don't know how someone lives like that.

[cbrachyrhynchos]

1. Human beings are only one species out of millions. Granted, physical anthropology gets a lot more money compared to microbiology but neither make a lick of sense without evolution as the unifying theory. Microbiologists and physical anthropologists use the exact same theory. Many people find it to be a fundamental inconsistency to say that influenza population genetics changes (evolution) in ways that make vaccines obsolete, but human population genetics does not.

2. It's not just that we descended from apes, it's that humans and apes are both hominids according to every single standard of biological classification one might wish to employ, at a standard of evidence much higher than any other theory taught within the science curriculum. Of course, one of the tragedies of evolution is that it's taught as "natural history," as a set of events that happened in the past rather than a unifying principle behind just about every observation we make about biology.

[(Anonymous)]

"Many people find it to be a fundamental inconsistency to say that influenza population genetics changes (evolution) in ways that make vaccines obsolete, but human population genetics does not."

THANKYOUUUUUUUU

[diet_poison]

...?

I'm not really sure where you're coming from. People who believe evolution is a thing do not, in fact, go around saying "Time for work! Evolution!".

[mimi-sardinia.livejournal.com]

That's my point - not everything in the world revolves around how it relates to evolution. People can go for days without thinking about evolution and live just fine, so why do I have to give a shit about evolution to get a fluvax? Or do any other normal function in life?

My point is, whether or not I believe in evolution does not make any difference to the practicalities of living.

[(Anonymous)]

So your point is that, religious people who are creationist who get flu shots are just idiots who don't think shit through?

I mean, I'm down with that.

[mimi-sardinia.livejournal.com]

Well I don't know if they're idiots (Creationists can be idiots, Evolutionists can be idiots, and their idiocy can have nothing to do with those stances), only that they don't give a shit about the evolutionary theory behind the influenza virus. The virus is still going to make them sick, the fluvax is still going to help them defend against it, so they get the fluvax.

[diet_poison]

I can see where people are coming from with the point that being anti-vax goes hand in hand with being anti-science. I don't think people are going to go to the doctor's office and then say, "WAIT! I don't believe in evolution. You can't give me a flu shot!" It's more of those who are anti-vax have already given it some thought and are more likely to buy into the anti-evo mindset as well, and one might inform the other.

Most of the time, though, you're right, it doesn't make a difference to the practicalities of living.

[feotakahari]

Um, no. I don't know anyone like that, and I have no idea where you're getting that.

I guess all I'm trying to say is that it's not about belief. You can't argue a tornado into not existing, and believing in the tornado won't make it any less likely to lift you off the ground. Tornadoes, like evolution, exist regardless of humans and have no mechanism with which to care about the opinions of humans. But at the very least, you'd be confused by someone denying that tornadoes exist and claiming they're an illusion devised by Satan, right?

[(Anonymous)]

You'd think so, wouldn't you?

[mimi-sardinia.livejournal.com]

That's the point I was making with that very exaggerated example, no one thinks like, especially someone who doesn't believe evolution is absolutely verifiable.

Tornadoes however are verifiable. I have yet to see a genuine Missing Link.

[feotakahari]

Oh, are you a Creationist? I thought this was just a philosophical enterprise.

As for missing links, we've got plenty of them (not to mention unicorns in the garden: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Lenski_affair) I'm not a scholar of the subject, having gotten most of my knowledge from Scientific American, but there are a lot of popular science books that explain the state of the research. I've heard The Panda's Thumb is pretty good.

Honestly, that's the one thing I want to get out here--that this is a living, breathing science, not a stagnant set of dictates. Scientists can and do argue with existing evolutionary models, and Darwin's old ideas have been pretty heavily revised thanks to new fossils and new DNA tests. If you want to argue the principles, read a few books, take a few classes, and get involved in the science. But please don't treat it like an abstract philosophical problem that nobody can or does research.