fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #3271 ]

⌈ Secret Post #3271 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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[Mysterious Universe Podcast]

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[Elias Ericson]

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[Danny Phantom]

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11. [SPOILERS for Jessica Jones]

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12. [SPOILERS for Homestuck]

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13. [SPOILERS for transformers: more than meets the eye #47]

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14. [WARNING for rape]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #467.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

It's the victims that are different. And that does make all the difference. Men have worked very hard to not be empathised with, and this is the logical result of that. People don't empathise with men. Empathising with killgrave is sick and wrong (I don't disagree) and empathising with Graham is a ridiculous waste of time. I understand all that, but what really boils my piss is when people blame this lack of empathy on women, like we're the ones responsible for men running the whole fucking lot of it.

If you are incapable of empathizing with someone because they happen to be a man, that is something wrong with you.

No. We, mostly women, are socialised, mostly by men, to not empathize with men. Yes it's fucked up. Yes men are disadvantaged by it. It has a detrimental impact on men's emotional intelligence. BUT it's not something we chose. It's something that was done to us.

So you're saying that your programed like a computer and incapable of independent thought because you're a woman?

Way to.put the movement back, sister.

Not because I am a woman. Women are the primary target of social conditioning, but it affects men as well. Men are just a unable to empathise with other men. Look at the MRA movement. And Independent thought is not the same thing as an emotional reaction (like empathy).

That... does not seem to fit with most feminist accounts I've read on this subject, to say the least.

Would you mind expanding on your thoughts here?

Would be glad to, What is unclear?

Generally, the idea that women are socialized not to empathize with men. In particular, I guess, how you think this operates - like, what specific ways do women not empathize with men - and where you think it comes from.

Because, like. I've seen a lot of people talking about the idea that women are trained to grant almost absurd degrees of primacy to male feelings. I don't think I've ever encountered this idea before. And it seems to be at odds. So I'm just curious to hear more.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2015-12-19 00:26 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) - 2015-12-19 00:28 (UTC) - Expand

We, mostly women, are socialised, mostly by men, to not empathize with men.

I'm curious as to what socialization you're referring to? Growing up, I was a voracious reader, and most of the protagonists in the books I read were male. While it may not have been the intent, it taught me to empathize with people, whether they were male or female.

A lot of the main characters in sci fi films are male. And again, I put myself in the shoes of that viewpoint character. Even on a lot of TV shows, we're shown the issues and problems of male characters and expected to understand and empathize because of what we're being shown.

So I'm really curious as to where you think we are being socialized to not empathize with men.

I'm a woman and I'm perfectly capable of not being a cunt and empathizing with victims, men included. Maybe it's a personal problem in your case, anon?

You're woman that calls other women cunts... Sure, Jan.

Even if this is true - and I personally find it to be horseshit- why n Earth is it an attitude you'd want to perpetuate? Rape is rape and victims are victims, with none better or worse than the other, regardless of gender.

I don't. I'm fighting to end it just like every feminist, but I am aware of this trend and where it comes from and it is relevant to this secretso I brought it up.

Be careful how you use the word 'every', often any statement with that word is untrue.

Fair point. Good catch. For every please read many.

You're hysterical. And kudos for getting people to fall for your nonsense. ;)

I for one never knew that I was programmed not to empathize with men. I mean, I didn't know they were robots incapable of deep emotion. I have to inform my father. :(

LOL, same. Honestly, I think some of the problems in my family arise from my menfolk having too much emotion and being too open with their feelings.

Yeah, my dad is pretty damn emotional as well. He tried to hide it sometimes because he was trying to be strong for us kids, but that is the result of being a single parent.

My father just had anger management issues when I was a kid, due to dealing with my brother and his emotional problems. Funny, I thought I was able to understand Daddy's problems and empathize with them. Now I see the light and realize I have been programmed by the patriarchy to dismiss men's feelings. Thanks, radfem anon. All these years of thinking I had normal relationships with my male family members. Thank you for showing me the truth.

kaijinscendre - 2015-12-19 01:07 (UTC) - Expand

Yeah, I was sitting here scratching my head over that whole thing, too. Certainly news to me!

MEN! ROBOTS IN DISGUISE!!!!

That seems unkind. Won't he be upset to find out that he's incapable of deep emotion? Oh wait - I guess he won't. ;)

My dad's reaction when I tell him.

Our abuse and rape experiences are not your political football either. Seriously, what's wrong with "that sucks, I'm sorry it happened to you?"