fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #3590 ]

[ SECRET POST #3590 ]

⌈ Secret Post #3590 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.

__________________________________________________

02.

__________________________________________________

03.

__________________________________________________

04.

__________________________________________________

05. [posted twice]

__________________________________________________

06.

__________________________________________________

07.

__________________________________________________

08.

__________________________________________________

09.

__________________________________________________

10.

__________________________________________________

11.

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 42 secrets from Secret Submission Post #513.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Uh, Thor/Loki are still related. Even if not by blood, they were still raised together. Adopted siblings are still siblings. So still incest.

I agree with you but whether or not other people do depends on whether their issue with incest is the biological problems that come with (several generations of) incest or the psychological issues involved.

I don't think you can say it isn't incest, though. Ship it, fine. Don't think it is the sort of incest that is illegal, fine. But they are brothers, and I think saying they aren't is rather dismissive of adoption.

Well, biological problems with incest aren't really relevant when you have a same-sex pair...

Westermarck might wish to have a word with you.

General "you" or are you talking specifically to me?

I'm having trouble figuring out how many people saw that I agree with philstar that there's more to it than biology. It's just that there are a lot of people who reduce it down to biology and ignore the psychology and they're still there no matter how many times we insist they're wrong.

I kind of misread I suppose, sorry!

Not a problem. Obviously I could have been clearer.

But is that incest? Like, could you get arrested for it? Morally, it might be wrong but I guess I don't count it as "real" incest.

It may not be the incest that is illegal, but they are brothers so it is incest. I think saying it isn't is very dismissive of adoption, whether or not you think this particular type of incest is morally wrong or not.

I think it depends entirely on what your definition of incest is.

Most states specifically include it in their incest laws and all 50 states and DC's incest laws cover it regardless because of the destination between adoption (a person becoming a permanent member of a family) and guardianship (temporary).

Destination = distinction. My tablet is on crack.

I count like 12 states that have laws regarding adoption using this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_regarding_incest_in_the_United_States

And some of those only seem to be in regards to parent/child relationships.

FYI, I don't approve of incest. I think that if nothing else, it is hard for it to be completely consensual because of power dynamics. However, I do think that in a fanfic world + the world of Space vikings is held to different standards.

Edited 2016-11-01 23:56 (UTC)

I just agree with the user above that it's dismissive of adoption. And maybe the laws have changed since I moved away from the country but twenty years ago it was definitely included in the incest laws of every state. I was sexually abused by my brother my entire childhood and he tried to argue that it wasn't incest because we're adopted. His lawyers wanted his case moved to another state and couldn't find one whose incest laws didn't apply to adoptees. The incest charge was the one they were most likely to get him on because he admitted it but said it was after I was of age and was consensual.

It's about societal expectations to me. Real adopted children who are supposed to be part of a family would count as incest. In a fanfic universe where people have non-family wards or guardianships and the kids aren't supposed to be regarded as family even if they live in the same house, it wouldn't be the same. If a kid's entire family was murdered by bandits and the Scottish lords of the next manor over took him in, I don't see that as a brother situation. That kind of situation with neighbors taking a kid in for a decade generally wouldn't happen in real life though, or it'd be considered official adoption, etc

I don't think "legally" is a good definition for incest. For one, it's going to depend on where you go - country by country, state by state, period in time by period in time.

You're probably just better off distinguishing between biological incest, and non-biological incest incest.

Yeah, that is a better argument.

This. There's a lot of wiggle room for fans debating if the characters truly think of each-other as related. But canon biology is biology. So Luke and Leia is incest, they're brother and sister, even though legally I really doubt Bail and Obi-Wan would be so careless as to make a legal record of them being Padme and Anakin's kids.

They were raised under the belief that they were actually blood-related so I'd definitely say it counts 100% as incest, and even with the reveal that doesn't suddenly erase their history as brothers and Thor still argues their family relation despite it which would still make it tick the incest box all around for me.

The only time I might consider adoption related incest as maybe not incest is if all parties are completely aware that they're not blood-related but even then it would entirely depend on the circumstances.

Yeah, I guess I just don't hold Space Vikings to the same standard as real people. Especially royal families that are all about the inbreeding.

And Loki does fight against being called Thor's brother (unless he is trying to manipulate Thor).

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #3590 ]

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7

Re: Inspired by #7