[ SECRET POST #482 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #482 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 62 secrets from Secret Submission Post #069.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 4 - too big ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

Re: 54 OP

[penguinfaery.livejournal.com]

Yes, but you're being just in broad in assuming that anyone who honestly thinks she's ugly is sexist, as the fangirl are assuming she's a whore cause she likes sasuke (or however they justify it) And although it's arguable that whore is a bigger or worse insult then sexist. (Althought I'm not one for the "OMG don't take it so seriously!" because sexism is sexism, even if towards some on fictional)

I don't agree about the bitch thing, because I personal see it having it's sexual trapping lost, but that may be where I live, and not true in other places, so we'll have to agree to disagree there. I think bitch, like many other words, is becoming non-sexed, but just cause it is here, doesn't mean it is in the context of the person using it. I just also agree with calling a spade a spade, and sometimes bitch reaches my finger tips before asshole. In the end they're both meant to convey that I don't like her personality.

I am very curvy and it actually helped me a lot, after all my role models being twiggy little waif boys (Because I'm sure you can imagine if I cosplay Tsunade no amount of duct tape would get me anywhere near the chest of whatever 15 year old boy I was fanning :3).

I think it just bother me because you see so much bashing on the sexist bit of Naruto (And actually, rarely on the things I see as sexist, like the medic nin thing. although I'd rather see a boy being medic nin. A manly boy. Which possibly Dan meet one of them) and very little apperication of the female-plus part of it. And I also think fixing some thing would take away from the realism. Unfortunatly our world is not perfect, and there's, being a somewhat fuedal conflict based world, would be less so. Art imitates life, you know?

Re: 54 OP

[(Anonymous)]

I'm not assuming that anyone who honestly thinks she's ugly is sexist. I'm assuming (in my opinion correctly) that anyone who calls her "ugly" in the context of "ugly whore" is doing so in a sexist manner. It's all about context. :)

Something I'd like to point out about the word "bitch," and its putative progress towards being non-sexed...

...when you see women called "bitch," it's sometimes a generic term of hostility, but it's also sometimes in the context of them being more masculine than is considered acceptable. More aggressive, more dominant, etc. A man who displays those traits would instead be called a dick or an asshole. When you see men called "bitch," it's almost always in the context of them displaying traits that are thought of as negatively feminine--being "weak" or whiny, for example. I don't think that means the word's becoming non-sexed; I think it means that the word is used against both genders when they transgress accepted gender norms, but still especially women.

Re: 54 OP

[penguinfaery.livejournal.com]

Like I aid, I use bitch as a general swap out for someone being an asshole. I call, for example, Kabuto a bitch all the time (And not in...a sexual sense before you bring that up.) But like I said, you do have a valid point, BUT were you honestly only upset about those exact three phrases?

If we're going to be arguing the specific finer points of the language used in them, that's a valid point. Because I picked it up as "I hate fans who make the board negative generalizations against the woman."

Re: 54 OP

[(Anonymous)]

If you use it that way, it's cool, but there's definitely an overall tendency to use "bitch" in a sexist way on both women and men.

For me it's a combination of being upset about the use of sexist language and assumptions when picking on characters (i.e. calling Ino a "dumb bitch" instead of saying "she's a shallow, insensitive jerk") and the tendency to hate on female characters in particularly vitriolic ways for nonsensical reasons (i.e., calling Sakura a whore despite her, uh, not being one in any way, or Hinata a stalker even though her scenes of watching Naruto are a relatively small part of her character...not to mention I've seen her bashed for being fat which is doubly offensive). Not just those three specific insults, but similar ones. Calling Tsunade a slut just because she has big breasts would qualify, for instance. (I don't think I've seen that, bu I've seen female characters called slutty for the same reason elsewhere, unfortunately.)

Re: 54 OP

[penguinfaery.livejournal.com]

I do agree with the hating (I've seen the big boob thing applied to Tifa quiet often, and I've heard Orihime gets it. I think Tsunade escapes because she has no intrest in any of the males, the only possible challenge would be Jiraiya, and most o the squealing fna girls are dumbhave no intrest in him.

And sexism is a big issue in fandom, I just see so much vitrol of it aimed at Naruto (not the fandom, but the show.) that I feel like is a waste compared to something like...Najica or Gantz (Oh JESUS Gantz...) that could use some of that negative energy. Our discussion has lead to a more indepth discussion of what you're saying, to the point where even the parts I disagree with I understand, but I saw plenty of comment that were like "Yeah Naruto sucks for females." and I really don't think it does. (Maybe it's just coming from comic fandom when you're told to stop bitching about things like the Mary Jane figure)