fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #491 ]

⌈ Secret Post #491 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

// Dear I-read-everything-in-code!anon,
if ("fandom!exclamation points"==annoying) { cry moar(); }

Secrets Left to Post: 20 pages, 495 secrets from Secret Submission Post #071.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 - too big ], [ 1 2 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I'm of the opinion that if one were directly involved in the night in question, say, it was their tragedy, they'd have every right in the world to be upset. If you survived Nazi Germany (and if so, I support you, Jewish survivor) then I'll hold them down so you can kick their ass.

Otherwise, it's not your tragedy.

Lemme take this a bit personal. My mother's side is from Korea. My grandfather vanished in the aftermath of the Korean War, and we're still not sure if he's in North Korea, skanking up what was then a sexy co-ed, or is dead. This left my mother (age 14 at the time) to raise her sister and care for her mother in what was a very shitty situation. She then immigrated to the US and is basically the sort of story which would make for a formula book about immigrants, touching and etc etc.

If there were an RP which dealt with the Korean War, or if she got pissed off at M*A*S*H* for covering the Korean War with a comedic front, she's entitled to do so. Fully entitled.

I don't have that same right. The Korean War was a tragedy. It's not my tragedy. And I think that's a distinction a lot more people should learn when responding to situations such as this one. There's a fine line between respect and appropriation that many people, I feel, have crossed.

That's strikes me a pretty weird. Does your mother feel that way? Does she think only the victims have the right to feel offended?

I don't see any appropriation in being disgusted by an offense than isn't towards a group you belong to. Can't a white person feel disgusted by racism? Of course they can. I actually think they have more responsibility to talk against it due to their privilege.

Leaving that aside, I think that you can't say 'that's MY tragedy!' or tell the offended party in how to behave if you aren't part of that group. Objecting towards the offense? Yes, I think you should.

Look at it this way: maybe you weren't a specific rape victim, that doesn't mean you shouldn't feel disgusted and horrified and offended towards the act in question. It's called empathy.

I see the appropriation in the sense...lemme put it another way. You can be disgusted. But you have as much claim to the incident as other parties do, for better or for worse.

Or to put it another way, it's the difference between "That's disgusting, but I acknowledge your right to make art of it, as distasteful as it is." versus "That's disgusting, and my claim to disgust trumps YOUR claim to the incident." Does that makes sense? I'm not saying that only the victims have the right to be offended: I'm saying that the participants in whatever horrible incident have a higher claim to said incident than non-involved third parties.

Which is what I somewhat read in the first comment in this chain: that if you're disgusted by something, one's disgust transcends other people's right to work with the incident. "Now, how would you feel if you found a RPG about your particular rape?....That's called trivializing a tragedy. Please, learn all of you," and all that. Sounded like a bit of appropriation to me.

I'm not disagreeing with you. I'm disagreeing with THAT. If you're that person, my apologies for misreading your intention. If not, here's clarification as to what I believe.

Yeah, I'm that person, but I still kinda confused about what are you saying. The 'rape' was just an example of how the offense works for the offended party.

the participants in whatever horrible incident have a higher claim to said incident than non-involved third parties.

I completely agree with that. There is no doubt about that.

But you seriously believe that if someone makes a RPG out of a real person's rape without the victim consent - and said victim finds it offensive, they have the same right to 'make art' than a third party has to object that 'art'?

They are being offensive, they are trivializing a tragedy and hurting other people by doing it. You are basically saying that if you aren't the person who is hurt, you have as much right to object about that hurt than the person who is doing it has to do the damage.

If I'm being racist and offensive towards a minority that I don't belong to, a person who isn't part of that group shouldn't feel entitled to tell me I shouldn't be racist. I have a right over my racism as they have over their objection. Is that what you are saying?

By the way, the people doing the RP weren't Jews. And in the case there was a Jew person playing, it wouldn't be so easy since it was something that affected a big group of people.

Of course, you writing about your particular rape is another matter. You are the only victim, you have any right to do whatever you want. Even if it's only for entertainment (it could be kind of creepy, but).

Trivializing a tragedy is bad because it can hurt someone else. When it doesn't...

Trivializing a tragedy is bad because it can hurt someone else

With 'someone else' I meant the victims, of course.

[ SECRET POST #491 ]

Re: 17

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Re: 17