[ SECRET POST #4001 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #4001 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 35 secrets from Secret Submission Post #573.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

I'm usually way more forgiving of Jo than seems to be fandom popular (I was fine with the epilogue, I don't think she hates fat people, I loved her ships, I don't care that she didn't make Dumbledore gay in the books, Draco would look terrible in leather pants), but I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this one. My only thought is that she knows what she's talking about, and there are things that are not for her to disclose. I like to think that as someone who has been a victim of abuse, she really did look into this thoroughly.

Although can I just say one thing? Jo may not have had much choice. Writers don't make all of the decisions, even when they're famous. She might have had to cover her ass from all sides, so this is what we got.

[(Anonymous)]

SA - And bad wording on the Dumbledore front. I don't care that she didn't outright "out" him in canon. I think there were pretty clear hints.

[(Anonymous)]

I mostly agree with you but I don't think you have to conclude that JKR hates fat people to notice that the Dursley stuff trades in a lot of negative stereotyping of fat people. Two different things there.

Also, I'm not sure I agree with the idea that casting Johnny Depp was something that she just had to accept. She's a dang billionaire. I have to think, if she really hated the casting, she would be able to do something about it. For better or for worse, I think you have to take her words and actions and decisions mostly at face value.

[(Anonymous)]

Why do people think she hates fat people?

[(Anonymous)]

Because of the way that the Dursleys are depicted.

[(Anonymous)]

So because of one family who personality wise (selfish hedonists) who would likely be fat among tons of skinny evil dudes, she hates fat people? HUh....

[(Anonymous)]

Not that they're uniquely evil, but because of the way that they're depicted

google, like, fatphobia durselys or something if you want to learn more. idk man.

[(Anonymous)]

MTE. These bad-faith, desperately reaching for things to validate their hate-on, interpretations people manage to convince themselves of are so weird and ridiculous.

[(Anonymous)]

You don't have to agree with it, but it's not in bad faith, and you really shouldn't say that things are in bad faith just because you don't understand them.

The argument, again, is not that the Dursleys are uniquely evil. The argument is that the depiction of the Dursleys trades in a bunch of stereotypical tropes of fat people that are emphatically negative. I don't think it's really reaching all that much to say that Harry Potter depicts Dudley and Vernon as physically grotesque, and connects their physical traits directly to their flaws as human beings.

Again, you don't have to agree with that, and you don't have to think that it's a big deal even if it's true, but I don't think it's prima facie absurd to think that is true. I don't know where you're getting this idea of bad faith from.

[(Anonymous)]

You worded this so much better than I would have if I'd tried to explain it.

[soldatsasha]

Don't forget that she uses very similar language to describe Umbridge and iirc Slughorn. Mrs. Weasley is the only fat character I can think of where it isn't explicitly negative.

I don't think that JKR hates fat people or is fatphobic or anything like that. But I do think that she has a tendency to use physical features as negative descriptions. Snape is thin and hook-nosed. Umbridge has a face like a frog. Petunia and iirc Narcissa are described as looking pinched and bony. Vernon and Dudley are grotesque. Pansy Parkinson has a piggy nose.

And, I can see why this sort of thing really bothers people or why they'd see it as fatphobia or body shaming. (I don't agree. I think it's just a feature of the genre and narrator.)

[(Anonymous)]

It came off to me as very Dickensian, the way he would describe his characters tying in with their personalities.

[(Anonymous)]

And even Mrs Weasley (fat) is described as way more flawed and annoying than say, Mr Weasley (thin).

And yeah, you can't really go for 'looks and other traditional values like money etc. don't matter, it's about what's inside!' and then go 'but also, hermione and ginny and harry got totally hawt!1 and everyone who ever criticised them was like, really fugly and just jellus!'

[(Anonymous)]

But Petunia's not fat? Dudley is because she spoils the fucking shit out of him.

I just assumed it was a direct contrast to starving Harry.

[(Anonymous)]

So she has the choice to write everything you approved of, and the only thing she's ever done you find questionable was out of the poor, helpless billionaire's hands? Convenient.