[ SECRET POST #4010 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #4010 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 24 secrets from Secret Submission Post #574.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

TLJ is a terrible movie in general

I don't think there's any reasonable sense in which this is true, but I'd be curious to hear your argument

the second worst Star Wars movie

This is just flatly impossible, you are wrong and I will not put up with this nonsense. TLJ is not worse than Phantom Menace or Attack of the Clones. That is wrong. No. I am not having it.

[(Anonymous)]

Well, there's the plot holes and the Magical Band Aid and all the filler stuff like every scene with Finn and Rose, plus the Porgs. It was like watching an Avengers movie. It can totally be enjoyable but objectively it is a bad movie in almost every way.

[(Anonymous)]

First of all, even with all of those things, Clones and Menace are still just fundamentally worse.

Second, I would argue that a blockbuster action movie being stylish, entertaining, and enjoyable makes it a good action movie. And I think The Last Jedi holds up in that regard. I don't think that the plot and pacing issues stop it being entertaining. So I guess my question is, what does it mean to be an objectively good movie?

[(Anonymous)]

There are dozens of factors that films can be graded on to determine how good they are. And no, it doesn't have much impact on if they're enjoyable to audiences. But in a series it can be an indicator of how audiences will respond based on how close it is to other movies in the series. TLJ has a lot of stuff that's popular with audiences right now. It doesn't have much of what's been popular with Star Wars audiences and specifically has things that have been unpopular with Star Wars audiences. So I'm not surprised at the reactions I've seen, meaning the people who have never like Star Wars loving TLJ and people who have liked the films for most of their lives not liking it or even hating it. I'm not talking the hardcore fans, I just mean your average person who's seen most of the movies, which compromises an estimated 85% of the American adult population. Star Wars is so big that I'm surprised how many people in this secret thread automatically assume every mention of viewers or fans means hardcore fans or the few thousand people who signed a petition because they didn't like TLJ.

[(Anonymous)]

So I'm not surprised at the reactions I've seen, meaning the people who have never like Star Wars loving TLJ and people who have liked the films for most of their lives not liking it or even hating it. I'm not talking the hardcore fans, I just mean your average person who's seen most of the movies, which compromises an estimated 85% of the American adult population.

You think that 85% of the American adult population dislikes and/or hates The Last Jedi? Or am I missing something here?

[(Anonymous)]

What specific things do you think that TLJ has that other Star Wars movies don't

[(Anonymous)]

Wow, you actually pulled a No True Scotsman for a Star Wars movie. Imagine having that little going on in your life and having so few worthwhile thoughts in your head.

I would like to extend my congratulations to the OP, who managed to summon a spot-on example of what they were talking about out of the woodwork.

[meredith44]

I was obsessed with Star Wars as a kid. Enough so that after seeing Return of the Jedi in the theater, I wore my hair in Princess Leia buns for a long time. I had Star Wars figures and playsets, and I read the books that followed. When Phantom Menace came out, I was so excited that I took the afternoon off work so I could get in line 10 hours early for the midnight showing to get good seats.

I consider myself a Star Wars fan.

And I liked The Last Jedi.

Was it amazing? I didn't think so. I had a number of issues with it. But was it the worst (or even second worst) of the movies? Not by a long shot, imo. And I really don't understand the vitriolic responses by some fans. So I respectively disagree that it was an objectively awful film overall, even as a Star Wars fan.

[(Anonymous)]

Same.
I'm a Star Wars fan and I liked it. Was it the best Star Wars film? No. Was it the worst? Definitely not.
Heck, I don't even think it's worse than The Force Awakens (I actually probably like it better? Not sure yet, would have to rewatch).

Yes, there were issues (For example: Did Luke deserve better as a person? Yes. Does it make sense how he was after more than a decade of self hate? Also yes.), but for some things it seems like "This didn't go the way I wanted it to go, so it's automatically a bad movie".

I was so excited to discuss this movie after leaving the cinema, but I won't touch the current fandom with a ten foot pole. :/

[meredith44]

I agree with everything you say here. (Well, except Rose was the part I disliked most.) After I watched it, I immediately went to go talk about it (I stayed away before because I hate spoilers), and i read enough that I didn't want to be part of it anymore. Which makes me sad, but there's nothing i can really do about it, I suppose.

[cbrachyrhynchos]

Same. My primary complaint is that it was a bit too derivative in taking beats from Empire and Return.

[meredith44]

I felt it was less derivative than TFA, and that was not one of my primary issues with it (unlike TFA), but I can definitely see where you are coming from.

[(Anonymous)]

Allan, Beam, Bean, Betjeman, Chapman, Courtenay, Dean, Donham, Douglas, Freeman, Graham, Jungman, Lam, Lanman, Maugham, Pakenham, Pulham, Putnam, Stan, Urban, Warham, Wenham, Wyndham

Appleby, Ashby, Cosby, Crosby, Ormsby, Ponsonby, Willoughby

Achenbach, Bach, Black, Block, Chattock, Dick, Finch, Fischbach, Fitch, Gasch, Goch, Hitchcock, McClintock, Pace, Percy, Popescu, Quick, Speck, Tuck

Allende, Bernardo, Brady, Bundy, Candy, Cody, Dundy, Hardy, Kennedy, Ladd, Lundy, Rodd, Rylands

Alexander, Alfred, Auden, Beverley, Bowers, Bowes, Bowles, Dahmer, Fltechley, Gardner, Garner, Karnes, Kemper, Kesey, Lees, Lopes, Mates, Mortensen, Mosley, Nesser, Noyes, O'Brien, O'Flaherty, Oliver, Olivier, Oppenheimer, Potter, Rader, Ryder, Smiley, Spencer, Suárez, Tolkien, Tree, van Cutsem, Welles, Wellesley, Whistler

Duff, Hoff, Schaeff

Bragg, Clegg, Digh, Grigg, Haigh, Hogg, Leigh, Mogg, Ostrenga, Page, Waugh

Bergdahl, Bright, Dahl, Hahn, Koshy, Night, Wright

Astin, Aulin, Cecil, Chamberlain, Kim, Klein, Lewis, Martin, McCain, Palij, Stein, Trefusis, Unwin, Weinstein

j

Dushku, Hicks, Homolka, Kaminsky, Klicka, Lukashenko, Nicks, Parks, Sapkowski, Stravinsky, Wachowski, Zwicky

Atwell, Bell, Birdsall, Buell, Campbell, Carroll, Cavill, Gill, Hall, Hill, Howell, Liddell, Lowell, Markle, Maxwell, Mayall, Morrell, Morrill, Nicholls, Nichols, Powell, Sackville, Sitwell, Steele, Tidwell, Till, Tindall

Blume, Gumm, Hamm, Hoitsma, Plame, Reitsma

Anthony, Bryant, Delevingne, Dunn, Evans, Farrand, Gladstone, Grant, Grint, King, Levine, McKenna, Rowling, Stearns, Stine, Stone, Tennant, Thynne, Trent, Warne

Acton, Altynbekov, Beaton, Berenson, Blood, Bloom, Carleton, Carson, Dalton, Dodgson, Eliot, Felton, Ferguson, Greenwood, Grosvenor, Karagalanov, Leighton, Lygon, Lyon, MacLeod, McQuiston, Merison, Nettleton, Nicholson, Nicolson, Odom, Parkinson, Paterson, Patterson, Pattinson, Sassoon, Tolson, Urusov, Watson, Wilson

Krupp, Shipp, Tripp
q

Astaire, Chalotra, Chambers, Earp, Ferry, Fry, Hambro, Herbert, Howard, Hurt, Lockhart, Manners, Shore, Short, Smart, Starr, Vickers, Zamora

Bliss, Closs, Cross, Forrest, Frost, Hearst, Krause, Krauss, McTavish, Trask, West

Abbott, Asquith, Barrett, Blanchett, Bratt, Gatty, Getty, Hewlett, Kratt, Lycett, McKennitt, Nasmith, Poulett, Smith, Strutt, Tyrwhitt

Montague, Pardue, Paul, Straub, Stroud

Altynbekova, Belikova, Levy, Love, Pavlova, Potapova, Romanova, Rove, Smirnova, Sobinova, Urusova, Vorotova

McKeown
x
Amaya, Payn
Lanza, Loaiza

[(Anonymous)]

DA

So... it has exactly the same weaknesses as every other Star Wars movie.

[(Anonymous)]

It can totally be enjoyable but objectively it is a bad movie in almost every way.

I feel like people keep using the word "objectively" when they really mean "subjectively." Or they keep using that word, and it does not mean what they think it means...