fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #544 ]

⌈ Secret Post #544 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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[formerly too big!]

Notes:

1. FRIENDING MEME III is still going!
2. Fandom comm meme at

heard_of_it!
3. Going to be doing some advertising for

livelongnmarry until the 15th! Thought it'd be win-win, people get to get their sites/comms out there, you get to find site/comms you might not have seen, and all the money gets donated, so. Just a little bit of extra scrolling to do, if you're not interested. (:

livelongnmarry [LJ] - panfandom auctions! Tons of stuff to bid on, and for a good cause.
Juxtapose Fantasy [website] - Yaoi/slash fans - have you visited JuxtaposeFantasy yet?
More Tales of Mu [website] - (More) Tales of MU: High Fantasy, Higher Education.

Secrets Left to Post: 06 pages, 130 secrets from Secret Submission Post #078.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 1 2 - repeat ], [ 1 2 3 4 - take it to comments ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I just don't get how people can complain all day long about how horrible it is to write characters OOCly, but don't see any problem with taking two equal male characters and turning it into a "you're so cute, I just can't control myself"/"i-iyaaan, dame~" relationship.

The big problem is that yaoi, if you look at the definition, is the original work. It's the publishing genre that is yaoi- therefore, an original work that has seme/uke dynamics IS perfectly valid. It's not OOC, because that's part of the characters, just like any other situations they react to in a certain way. But taking two previously established characters and warping them in a sexual way to fit the seme/uke dynamics is still warping them. It can certainly be done in a convincing, IC way, but it needs to have the effort put into it to be so, just like any other part of fanfiction. And again, personal preference is one thing- if you WANT to ship a couple as stereotypical seme/uke, that's one thing, fine, I don't mind- you're enjoying it and that's really all fandom is for. But once you start infringing on other people's shipping and going "BUT [BLANK] ALWAYS TOPS, HE'D NEVER BOTTOM, HOW OOC!" that's when you get ridiculous, imo. :/

Eh, I tend to take a live-and-let-live approach to seme/uke roles most of the time. Even though I'm sick to death of the personally and can't read 99% of BL as a result, I know some pretty old school people in fandom from back in the day when seme/uke roles were taken as Japanese gospel which could never ever be broken on pain of death.

My big problem with the OP's assertion is that seme/uke roles are "typically Japanese", and the implication that the genre can't exist without them. Because it frankly does exist without them, drawn by the hands of - zomg - Japanese people who agree that said roles are so much crap in a basket.

I agree with you, though, that changing the characterization of canon characters to make them fit seme/uke tropes is still changing the characterization. Often irrevocably destroying it, making them unrecognizable. And though I find that most people are primarily concerned with the devolution of their beloved characters into weepy four-year-old girls, I personally hate the big bad rapist of doom seme transformation even worse.

(And I shamelessly admit that part of this is due to the fact that my main fandoms are video games, and often the character-turned-rapist could never beat the character-turned-four-year-old in a fight and does so here purely for porn. It makes me think that the writer has never played the games, which is one of the few things that pisses me off more than seme/uke roles.)

/thoughts on yaoi

*nods* I don't mind at all if other people do it. They like it! That's not a bad thing, really. I personally think it's very easy to make most characters OOC by trying to shove them into those roles, if it's done carelessly- and that seems to be the case a lot of the time. I tend not to enjoy it then because it's less Character A/Character B and more Stereotypical Seme With Character A's Name/Stereotypical Uke With Character B's Name, and I can't stand seeing someone's entire personality and abilities discarded without any attempt at reasoning out why. But in that case, I just won't read it, and if they don't like my writing Character B/Character A, they're free not to read my stuff too. It's when they go around proclaiming that the characters are OOC because they're not shoved into the normal seme/uke boxes for that pairing that I get annoyed.

And yeah, seme/uke isn't the driving force behind yaoi, even if it is common- it exists, but it's not something necessary for the genre. And just because something is "slash" and not "yaoi" doesn't mean it will be any more realistic.

(Argh, the rapist stereotype enrages me for entirely seperate reasons than seme/uke dynamics. I'm sorry, I don't care if the seme could bring down the uke, as soon as they force themself on someone who is going "n-no, please, stop!"- even if it DOES have little heart-marks after it- unless it is in character for them to do so, my respect just flies out the window. Rape or forcing sex is just not something all characters would do. Some, yes, but... mrrgh.)

(My favorite example is Yamamoto and Gokudera, which just... their personalities WOULDN'T WORK THAT WAY. "I-iyaaa, Yamamoto, s-stop~" "What? O-oh, sorry, okay!" "... NO, idiot, I didn't mean STOP, keep going." "But you said-" "Just go back to doing that, retard!" "Haha, okay..." "... A-aaahn..." "Hahahahaha sorry but this is really funny Gokudera-" "askjfsafhgjj FORGET IT. FUCK OFF. NO SEX FOR YOU EVER.")

/thoughts on... idk random XD

[ SECRET POST #544 ]

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