fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #565 ]

⌈ Secret Post #565 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 07 pages, 173 secrets from Secret Submission Post #081.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 4 - too big ], [ 1 2 - repeat ], [ 1 - posted twice ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

The point is that if you think the art is bad because she traces, why the heck are you still buying it? And if you think the art is still good, how the heck do you care whether she traces?

And if you think the art is still good, how the heck do you care whether she traces?

If she's tracing, it could be because she actually has no talent. If that's the case, then she needs to find something she's actually good at and leave the art to the artists.

I'm still kinda confused. How do you care if someone has talent if he/she produces fanart that you enjoy? Enjoy even to the point of actually paying for it?

I work for my money. Every dollar represents a certain investment of minutes of my life that I won't get back that I am choosing to spend when I purchase something, be it a can of diet coke or a painting. If I think someone spent a lot less time doing something than I initially thought, it's possible for me to think, "Well, shit, I paid too much for that." Do I still like looking at it? Sure. Do I wish I had paid less? Yup.

I wouldn't pay for it, personally, and I care because I'm an artist too. And it annoys me that someone can make money/be somewhat in the "big leagues" while basically lying- claiming someone else's work as their own.

Like if you wrote a story and someone took it, changed a few things here and there and then it got published as their work, essentially.

If you don't get this, I don't know what else to say.

Like if you wrote a story and someone took it, changed a few things here and there and then it got published as their work, essentially.

Ahem... that's what basically ALL fanartists and fanwriters do ALL the time XDDD

Fanfics should not make profit, most fanfics are written using Fair Use copyrights, and have disclaimers stating as much. Fanart isn't normally an issue, because you can't really buy much artwork aside from artbooks, and artbooks are generally more expensive than fanart; doujinshi USUALLY are sold for the price it takes to make them- people aren't actually supposed to make too much profit on them, but you're missing the point.

Whatever, I'm pretty much convinced you're not the brightest crayon in the box. Have a nice day. ♥

Oh Lord, now you're talking about copyrights and profit... Ok, let's just drop all unanswered questions and decide that I'm just too stupid for this and it is me who is missing the point all along.

And of course you are right as usual, artbooks are so much more expensive than fanart - everybody can get one from ebay for ten bucks (and that would be a whole book full of pictures), while commissions from decent artists usually vary from $25 to $150 a piece.

...uh, because I bought it at a con ages ago and I just now saw this?

Once again. What does the fact that she traces change now in your perception of the art piece you considered worthy of buying back then?

I wouldn't have paid as much; it's still pretty, but it involves less work. Is it wrong for me to think this? I don't think I was a big dumb idiot, because I didn't know. But I thought she was much more talented than me; I can trace, too.

It's just like I'll never pay $200 for a Suzan Lovett print at a con auction again now that I know I can get it from her website for $40? Live and learn. I learned that: sometimes doujinshi artists trace (this secret); and I can be really dumb with a pocket full of money in an auction when I want something NOW and feel thwarted (that auction).

Well, buying something from a website for less money does not really seem related to the situation we are discussing.

Can you go to the website to order the same picture and pay less money? Yes. Hence, you choose a cheaper way.

Can you make a picture of comparable level by having the same reference? No. Hence, you still buy it. Easy.

Doujinshikas and fanartists are not the only ones who trace. There's manga called Basilisk which is completely traced and even all backgrounds are grayscaled photomanips. Can you make a manga of a similar level, sell millions of copies worldwide and win Kodansha Manga Award? No. Hence, you buy it.

I have two friends who draw. One spends on average 10-20 hours on a piece, another one - never more than 2 hours, otherwise he gives up and throws it away to never finish. The finished works they produce are very similar in quality and even in style. I guess just the first one is more slow and perfectionistic, and the second one is more gifted and skilled with his tablet. Following your philosophy, I should respect the works of the first friend much more than I should do so for the works of the second one. It still does not make sense to me.

Do they trace? It's not about time spent. It's about effort. If someone has a gift, then that's different. I don't take very long to draw, but I draw from scratch. It give me, personally, a bigger sense of satisfaction knowing it's something from my head and not stolen from someone else's. It's sad that people will trace to get recognition when they don't deserve it.

Both use references occasionally and reasonably, but never base their works solidly on one borrowed photo. And I used time as just exemplification of the effort put to it - believe me, in this case the gap is the same as if we managed to count effort directly.

As for the sense of satisfaction, now THAT is something I can totally understand and agree with. My confusion was solely considering the situation when one is on the "consumer" side and how the process of art creation could influence its perception. I also feel much better when I manage to create something new rather than, say, colour someone else's lineart, but when I see a completed piece - either on the Internet or in a museum, the facts like "this took 7 years to accomplish" or "the artist killed all the people depicted here and was eating them while drawing" are intriguing, but don't really influence my perception of the art itself. After all, tracing is just a modern way of posing.

[ SECRET POST #565 ]

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