fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #584 ]

⌈ Secret Post #584 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Layout entries'll be posted later tonight!

Secrets Left to Post: 15 pages, 371 secrets from Secret Submission Post #084.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 1 2 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 - empty comment ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

This conversation is transient, and has no consequences for either of us. The same could not be said for real life.

This is just not true. A conversation is a conversation is a conversation; whether it happens over the phone, on the Internet, over the dinner table, on on the street is a matter of form, and to a limited extent context, but not of content. Whether words hurt or not is a matter of content, and perhaps to a limited extent context, but not of form.

People are still people whether they're on the Internet or not.

I'm anonymous. I can easily close this window right now and all I'll carry away from this conversation is the emails in my inbox, which I can delete. The only thing I could call more transient than that was if I hadn't tagged the thread for email tracking.

So, because it doesn't bother you, it's okay?

Fail.

Really? You can erase it from your living memory that easily?

If that's true, I don't know whether I envy that or feel very, very sorry for you. A little bit of both, I think, but more the latter than the former.

I can't. And I wouldn't want to.

Honestly, a spoken word on the wind is far, far more transient for me than anything I've seen in print, whether on paper or on a screen. If you can treat this as that transient, I would imagine you'd be even more callous to someone in real life.

The other person would see my face. True, I could never meet them again, but I could also meet them again and have their impression of me be effected by the way I had previously acted. They could also potentially tell other people, spreading it to people whose opinions I did care about.

As it is, I'm anon. You have no idea who I am. I could log on under an LJ name and start replying to this thread arguing against myself now, and you'd have no idea.

So what? The exchange still happened. Whatever hurt or pride or giggles anyone got out of it still happened. If you want to sockpuppet argue against yourself, I'm all for it. Doesn't change anyone else's feelings about it.

People are still people, whether they're on the internet or not. There is a living, breathing person typing on a keyboard (or more than two; I don't know if all you anonymice are the same or not, but that doesn't matter) on both ends. Just because you can't see me, or I you, doesn't make either one of us less of a real person. Whether the exchange can have consequences for either one of us doesn't erase anyone's humanity for the duration of the exchange. (I don't actually believe communication can happen without consequences, even if they're minor, so that last is a moot point for me anyway.)

Well, in your terms, it does erase my humanity, because I really don't care on your opinion of me. You have no idea who I am. I can walk away from this and there are no implications on my character, because you don't know who I am. Maybe this makes me callous or heartless in your opinion, but that doesn't and can't actually effect me. What consequences could you actually call down on me personally because of this exchange?

Perhaps this makes me a bad person. And I could call up that I'm not the only one, but I know that's a flawed argument. I could possibly justify it by saying that my internet socialisation has been different from yours, and so I act by different norms and values, but I don't think that really justifies anything. Oh well.

Being able to walk away from a conversation on whether or not you should be allowed to use slurs casually just makes you privileged. It has nothing to do with the internet or your anonymity.

Privileged how? Are you assuming things about me now?

No, I'm talking about this kind of thing:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_privilege
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Male_privilege
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterosexual_privilege

So you're assuming I belong to one or all of those groups, and that's how I can walk away from slur usage with no baggage? You really think all of the users on 4chan are straight white males? All of them?

Nope, I just think you're probably straight and white.

Plus, being able to walk away from a conversation about this kind of thing unaffected is a hallmark of privilege. I just thought I'd introduce you to the concept.

Wrong on both counts. Not that it matters, or that I can prove it. But still, you know what they say about assumptions.

Being able to walk away from a conversation about this kind of thing unaffected is also a sign of 'being from 4chan'. Ethnicity, gender and sexuality really have nothing to do with it anymore. We're living the post-modern reality. Stop trying to fight it.

... How does that change anything? In real life, you walk away from a conversation. There isn't even a text record. That doesn't change anything at all. What point are you trying to make?

[ SECRET POST #584 ]

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