[ SECRET POST #4334 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #4334 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 08 secrets from Secret Submission Post #620.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[soldatsasha]

All of Undertale's backstory seems to be a lot of implied implications implying things. I don't remember the game ever saying much about Chara's background, but a lot of people (myself included) assumed Frisk was abused and possibly many of the other human children. We know that Chara went up the mountain to commit suicide, and then after finding a family and home they still decided to use Asriel to attack the humans. It's not too much of a stretch to assume that something was done to Chara to make them hate humans so much.

[(Anonymous)]

We don't actually know they went to commit suicide, we just know they went up the mountain for a "not happy" reason. Which could very well be wanting to kill everyone in the world, for all we know. You don't have to be abused by a group of people to want those people dead. Sometimes you're just an asshole.

[(Anonymous)]

Eh, it was more in some of the tapes it comes across a textbook abuse situation, nevermind that the implications of "no one comes back" would lead one to believe that everyone who went there died. Sooooo... That pretty heavily implies suicide attempt. Like, how the fuck would going up a mountain where the people who go disappear lead to them being able to kill everoyne?

[(Anonymous)]

Maybe they wanted to scare their family because they were an asshole, or make their village freak out about them out of spite by going to a supposedly "deadly" mountain to hide for a few days before they fell by accident. They were sure happy enough to want to kill everyone in their village when given the chance. Maybe they wanted to go up the mountain to find animals to torture and kill, didn't take the warnings seriously because they were arrogant, and then fell by accident. Those could also be "not happy" reasons to do it.

What exactly in the tapes comes across as a textbook abuse situation? Unless you mean them abusing Asriel. I've seen people bending over backwards to try and explain why them laughing off nearly killing Asgore with the flowers as a sign that they were REALLY SCARED, HONEST which I just don't find believable, especially considering what else we know about them. If the whole idea that they were abused comes from the assumption that they went up the mountain to kill themselves, even though we don't even know if that was the case, then it's all just speculation built on speculation.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm gonna stop you at the laughing.

There is legit a thing where sometimes you get so scared you laugh something off. Because otherwise it's so fucking awful to you mentally you fucking break. It's an awful feeling to have where you feel the only option to not break into a million tiny pieces is to laugh because it's the only thing you can do to protect our fragile mental state, and the only people I ever see going on and on about "Chara was a sociopath NO REALLY" are people who don't want to admit that genocide runs are 100% on them, the player, and it's not Chara who's a genocidal maniac, but the player wanting that 100% completion to the point they'll ignore that they're committing literal genocide in a video game meant to make you question why we HAVE to always fight and kill, and why there can't be systems based around pacifistic gaming.

The fact is, if Chara was always such an awful, sociopathic monster, I think other monsters would have comments on it beyond, you know, "Oh they laughed at this one thing that was kinda awful and traumatic! And they hated humanity!" They never abused anyone besides Asriel. Chara was fucking adored by everyone in the underground, which speaks volumes. Considering they were the first human child to fall down there, and the implications are humans were inherently violent to them, the fact Chara was held in such high regards implies that, no, they weren't a sociopath.

Like, dude, I'm sorry you're stuck on this idea they have to be a sociopath, but they're clearly not from how everyone, including the very animal-like monsters that would very easily fit the "sociopath killing animals" shit, regard them.

[(Anonymous)]

I knew someone would bring up the "but sometimes people laugh at traumatic situations!" thing. I'm one of those people, and I'd buy it if Chara were a real person. But everything we hear about Chara is that they're a deeply fucked up kid, with tendencies towards cruelty, so don't seem to have too much remorse when their actions cause suffering. The monsters of the underground are absurdly trusting and friendly, with the exception of Sans and maybe Undyne, and they aren't the greatest judges of character. It's even mentioned that they still loved Chara "despite their flaws" which to me reads that Chara was pretty fucked up and not that great a person.

Doesn't mean they weren't abused or whatever, but Chara definitely was not a nice innocent child based on what we get from their backstory.

[(Anonymous)]

I mean yeah, but that doesn't equate to "they were a horrible sociopath who were going up the mountain to kill animals and somehow they managed to not kill a single monster the entire time somehow but truly they were a sociopath." That's the point I was arguing against specifically.

They's an abuse case with some really fucked metrics. Full stop. Monsters are trusting, but they also still try to kill Frisk. Chara makes the most sense as an abuse case, not a sociopath, because like. They didn't kill anyone or cause any real damage until they killed themselves.

[(Anonymous)]

I like your assumption that the only reason I'd think they were a sociopath is because I can't take responsibility for my own actions. I know full well what I did and what I carry for doing it. I don't blame them for any of that because I know that I personally made those choices. I believe they're not a good person and were likely a sociopath based on pretty much everything the game tells us about them before we even show up. Asriel, the one person in the game who LOVED THEM THE MOST OUT OF ANYONE, who is the MOST biased and obsessed about them, literally tells you that they were not a good person. Asriel straight up tells you that Frisk is who they WISHED their sibling was, and NOT what their sibling ACTUALLY was. Asriel TELLS you that they could FEEL how much their sibling wanted to kill. That they had to fight to STOP them from killing. Not to mention, the whole idea of Asriel taking their body up to the surface into the center of their village to see the flowers was THEIR idea, and given that they know and hate humans and that they knew how that would look to humans, you could even see it that they deliberately set up Asriel to get attacked so they'd have an excuse to convince Asriel to kill them in self-defense.
Not only that, but when Flowey talks to you about being soulless and not caring about anyone or anything any more and only seeing other people as toys or pawns in a game, he specifically says that only his sibling could understand how that felt. What makes Flowey see them in you is you methodically killing people. That does NOT speak well for who they were and how they acted before you even played the game.

I don't know where you're getting the idea that anyone besides the Dreemurrs cared about them whatsoever. Literally no one in the Underground except the Dreemurrs, and even then mostly Asriel, talks about them at all except in vague generalities, as a symbol of hope for peace and not a person. I think the fact that the Dreemurrs were willing to adopt a human child after everything humans did to them says way more about the DREEMURRS than that child personally. Namely that the goat family is trusting and loving of strangers to a fault, even to their own detriment, which is exactly what the game repeatedly tells us about that family (and monsters in general).

You still didn't tell me exactly what in the tapes points to them being abused. I also don't think the argument that they're not a sociopath because they only knowingly abused ONE person, the person who loved them the most no less, is that great.