Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2008-09-13 04:52 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2008-09-13 04:52 pm
[ SECRET POST #617 ]
⌈ Secret Post #617 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
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Notes:
CITY NEEDS → [ env sec ind pop com ]
Secrets Left to Post: 24 pages, 583 secrets from Secret Submission Post #089.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 4 5 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 4 5 - repeat ], [ 1 - empty comment ], [ 1 2 - doing it wrong ], [ 1 2 3 LOL - troll ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
Re: About 101,
Because, see, I get really annoyed with people who think that just because writers don't want Goku fucking his father figure, he's being "left out". Saiyuki is such a great, complex story, with complex relationships, that the idea that the four main characters have to be paired off is just... well, offensive. And insulting.
Goku and Sanzo love each other. That I will totally agree with. But the parallels drawn between Goku and Sanzo's relationship, and Kouryuu and Koumyou's relationship are just so blatent, IMO, that sexually pairing Goku and Sanzo just strikes me as wrong. We get the incest already, with both Gonou and Kanan and with Jien and Mama Sha, and I have a really hard time accepting that Minekura would draw those parallels and then include yet more incest subtext. Been there, done that.
Plus, the Goku/Sanzo shippers tend to really like dismissing Pippi. I've even seen comments that, since she wasn't given a name, she obviously wasn't important, and that's some bullshit. You don't get to give people shit for not thinking the monkey bottoms for the monk if you are actively dismissing his canon love interest.
The relationship dynamics among the ikkou are very carefully balanced. Hakkai and Gojyo are married (or, if you don't ship them, hetero life mates). Goku and Sanzo are father and son (or, if you don't buy that, older brother/younger brother). I'll totally buy Sanzo/Gojyo/Hakkai, although not Sanzo/Hakkai (Sanzo wouldn't, not with someone who would do as he asks so readily) or Sanzo/Gojyo (at least, not without Hakkai's consent, because Sanzo in in charge and Hakkai is everything), and I'll buy Goku/Gojyo (the pervert teaching the little brother the facts of life) or even Goku/Hakkai (the teacher with no morals providing the student hands-on education), but Saiyuki is Goku's coming-of-age story, and I can't see Sanzo permitting a sexual relationship to occur with his
youthful wardcharge.tl;dr: just because Goku isn't getting fucked doesn't mean he's being left out.
/mops up
Re: About 101,
Yes, absolutely.
Hm...I do wonder if I'm just choosing to be blind/obstinate in this aspect. Not good at discarding a pairing, so I'll just have to agree to disagree. Especially because the reason I can't quite ship Gojyo and Goku is because their relationship seems too brotherly by far. yet, has drawn it. And RP'd it...well, that was then. *shrug*
Augh, if anything else didn't make me ashamed to ship 393...*cringe* Not important...o_O;?
Funny thing about fanfiction is one very rarely finds fic that fits exactly how you see the characters. More often than not the best you can hope for is a writer who writes well enough to convince you at least for the duration of the story. But again, that may be O.T.
Re: About 101,
,i>Annoyed, but Generally Annoyed, not Annoyed At You, honest.It was late, and I was tired, and I came off a little more "rawwwrgh don't write this!!!" than I intended. My bad. With Saiyuki, with the well-rounded and yet still open to interpretation characters Minekura has created, you can make an argument that any pairing can be done, and done well. My beef is more with the people who think that the ikkou has to pair off, and that not including Goku is the same as leaving him out. I mean, in a group of close friends, if two of you are a couple, that doesn't mean the others are being left out and have to start screwing, right? Not all relationships have to be sexual ones, and fandom forgets this.
I love Goku. He's a fantastic character, and Saiyuki is his story - not Sanzo's, not Ukoku, Goku's. It's the idea that in order for him to be a complete character he has to be in a sexual relationship that bothers me
that, and the excessive woobification of Sanzo in the majority of Sanzo/Goku fics that I've read, but that's a different rant.)And I completely agree that Gojyo and Goku's relationship is a brotherly one, and that's the reason why, while I wouldn't ship them, I can buy them having a brief, probably one-time sexual relationship where Gojyo answers Goku's questions about the birds and the bees and ends up, like, teaching him how to jerk off. Something like that, not snuggles and declarations of love, is what I meant.
And signed, on your comment about fanfiction. There are very few fics I've read that come close to my interpretation of these characters, but that's fine - it's my interpretation! Not yours, or anybody else's. :)
Re: About 101,
That's why I was very lucky to get my introduction to the fandom (in fact, they were the reason I even became interested in Saiyuki) through X-Parrot's fics, which are mostly gen and focus on the ikkou as a whole group of people.
Hope that made any sense.
I can understand why, I suppose
Mm-m, thought sadist!Sanzo worries me more.Funny thought, anime!Sanzo does seem to vary between angsting at the drop of a hat and overt cruelty :P...naaw, the anime just fails at concise characterization, old news, I know.
Hurrah for different interpretations :D
BTW, I hope the commenter under whose comment we're having this discussion doesn't mind. Sorry. >3>;