fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #4525 ]

[ SECRET POST #4525 ]

⌈ Secret Post #4525 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

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Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

"but slash/BL fandom at large doesn't want to hear it bc most of the ppl in it like to think they're above reproach, but as a lesbian some of the shit i have seen slash/BL fans say make my skin crawl bc it's the exact same kind of language that skeevy, fetishistic het guys have said to me[or i've seen said online] and like.. it's not better just bc it comes from a girl yanno? there are still gay men out there who are seeing what you're saying about them and they GET to be skeeved out by that.

but largely i think you're right, it's not regular 'i like this thing and it's fun' type fans who are the issue, it's the ones who've made liking slash/BL into some kind of identity so they're stuck unable to evaluate their behavior bc they consider that a personal attack."

<---I think this hits the nail on the head. It seems like the people who most need to hear these criticisms are the ones who are deliberately closing themselves off to it because their entire fandom identity is centered around being a "crazy fujoshi fangirl uwu" and so any critique against the sometimes toxic themes that run through the genre and the fandom that spawns from the genre can feel like a direct attack on them.

Personally, just speaking from my own experiences in fandom, I think part of this stems from back a few years ago when there was an attempt to frame being a fujoshi as some kind of empowering feminist "embracing female sexuality" power inversion thing. The issue of course being that this wasn't women inverting the power structure on straight cis men, they were just literally the female version of the guy who gets off on reading lesbian superhero porn comics and they were doing the same exact thing to gay men, who aren't exactly at the top of the patriarchy pile and it's not "punching up" to fetishize them, especially when very often these types of people talk out of both sides of their mouth on the issue (I see a LOT of people do stuff like post their latest Voltron teenage smut picture and then like tweet two hours later about how guys watching lesbian porn is gross and creepy, that sort of thing).

"that's not to say i don't think het women can't write m/m stories or porn, but maybe take actual gay men's feelings into consideration when talking about them? and maybe listen when they tell us what tropes/writing choices are homophobic to them?"

This! There are so many awesome female m/m artists and writers who are incredible and they run the gamut from being LGBT themselves to being cis het, and the thing they all have in common is being chill and just essentially being "normal" fans. It's very possible to write predominantly or even exclusively m/m stuff while still not coming across as fetishizing. Being willing to listen and grow as a creator is probably the best way to participate in m/m fandoms without coming across as creepy or entitled IMO.

Unless the girls posting gay porn and talking about how hot it is are treating real gay men the same way (and 99.9% of them don't; that's a strawman from the early 00's) there's literally nothing wrong with finding fictional sex sexy even if it happens to be of two men and you're not a man. Same for men who read F/F porn. If they treat real lesbians and bi women normally it doesn't matter in the least if they jerk off to femslash.

This. I do not give a damn about people fantasizing and getting off on fictional characters having sex with other fictional characters, I care about how they treat real people. As long as they're tagging their stuff, staying in their lane, and leaving real people alone, they're doing nothing wrong.

Straight people are not staying in their lane and leaving real people alone. Relationship violence against bi people is a huge problem, as is harassment of gay/lesbian people.

No, liking fictional sex doesn't make one an abuser or harasser. It doesn't make one an ally either. And I've learned the hard way that straight people who are very forthcoming about how queer sex fantasies are hot to them often turn out to be chasers or unicorn hunters. That's not everyone, but it's enough to put me off relationships with straight people.

Not the group AYRT is talking about.

ds.

idk i'v got a particular bone to pick with so called 'allies' in fandom when they barge into our conversations, tell us what 'LGBT rep actually is' and completely ignore any and all talks about f/f 'bc that's not hot to us, ew'.

they don't have to be all-in with f/f, but ONLY accepting LGBT rep that they find 'hot' IS homophobic, and i see it far more than i'd like tbh.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #4525 ]

AYRT

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