fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #636 ]

⌈ Secret Post #636 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Woooooah, it's like SPN secret day.

CITY STUFF → http://lolbuttsex.myminicity.com

And the Phoenix Wright kink meme (http://teagueful.livejournal.com/41371.html) says they need some help filling out requests! PW FANDOM, THE KINK MEME CALLS.

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 80 secrets from Secret Submission Post #091.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 1 2 - not!secrets ], [ 1 2 3 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Angelfucking is bad and wrong, but brotherfucking is totally a-okay!

Angelfucking with a possessed body that has a non-consenting person inside it IS worse than consensual brotherfucking. Consensual brotherfucking does not require the rape of an innocent bystander.

LOL, incest is still wrong whether or not it's better than rape. The point is that you really can't call "ew gross, moral card" when the fandom's normal shipping includes incest.

...

...

...

Any kind of consensual sex no matter how disgusting to you or me personally cannot possibly be worse than rape.

It may appall and disgust you if two adult brothers fuck each other, but who, other than perhaps themselves, are they hurting? How can this possibly be equally wrong as a person having sex with a demon or angel using someone else's body?

Reading comprehension here, I already answered your question.

incest is still wrong whether or not it's better than rape.

I find it difficult to care about what people do in bed if everybody who comes to the party is old enough to say yes or no and is happy about being there. It's the difference between, "OMG you should be on Jerry Springer" and "OMG you should be in prison for the rest of your life."

Sorry if that's too subtle a distinction for your morality.

*sigh*

My advice: Stop trying.

She's so stuck on Being Right that she'll flip right over your argument.

incest is still wrong whether or not it's better than rape.

Decides... who? :/ The reason people realized incest is "bad," originally, had nothing to do with morality; it's because any children that may result get genetically fucked-up and you get birth defects. Two males or two females don't actually have this problem, so that argument is out. The only other argument that makes sense is that, IRL, IN MANY CASES (I would even venture to say most cases), incest is either nonconsentual, one of the parties taking advantage of the other, or it has strong emotional and/or psychological fallout. And, since it's fictional, that can easily be gotten around by... um, not writing it that way.

And yeah, I can call "ew gross, moral card" because I don't see anything morally, physically, or in any other way wrong with two (or more) consentual adults in any sort of relationship that is not hurtful to anyone, including themselves..

So, yeah. I'm not even arguing that it's better than rape, which you are agreeing to. I'm arguing that, if written as consentual and the two of them screwing up each other in the head or heart, Wincest (or any other incest pairing) has no reason to be seen as "morally" wrong at all anyway.

Lol I'm not even in this fandom. This just bothered me. =X

Edited 2008-10-03 04:09 (UTC)

Well, to be fair, incest in general is going to be fucked up, whether or not it's consensual. There's a family dynamic already in play-- especially in the case of Wincest. I know lots of people like the pairing because it's fucked up.

Personally, I think that if you assume Wincest is not an extremely screwed up pairing and instead think it's fluffy bunnies and somehow gives you the moral high ground over angelporn, I'm just going to laugh. And laugh. And laugh.

Have fun thinking your kink is more okay than ours!

Yeah, liking a pairing because it's fucked up is fair. Liking incest because it's fucked up is fair. Not all incest is going to be fucked up, even with the family dynamic, depending on the individuals involved- it's just very likely to be so, especially if one family member is in a position of "power" over the other (close siblings potentially not having as much of a problem as a parent/child relationship always would, etcetera). There are some people who can deal with having both a familial and a romantic love for someone, though. Rare, but possible, and I'm mostly just saying that if people wanted to write it without moral problems or fucked-up-ness, they could do it that way.

And actually, it's not my kink. I don't have any problem with it, and I tend to ship... well, everything, but I don't really have any non-canon incest pairings that I prefer over those characters with other people. (Well, maybe one. I kind of fell out of that fandom and like it partially because it has an element of being rather unhealthy for them, anyway...)

I'm not even saying that the kink of angel/human sex is wrong (hell, I ship it!) or that you couldn't argue good reasons for shipping Whatshisface-who-kind-of-makes-me-start-watching-SPN-again and Dean. Your kink is just fine. People have non-con as a kink and I don't really give a crap about that either. XD I just think trying to deny that there would be pretty much rape involved in the pairing if the angel is possessing someone who would probably not be okay with the sexin's is kind of ridiculous. There are undoubtedly ways around it, but even if not, just try to keep it in mind and keep it IC and it's... really not a big deal.

Coming back to this late but: it's only rape if you assume the person being possessed didn't consent to the possession. Clearly a lot of people do. (Either that or the body's technically dead, but is it really dead when an angel's animating it?)

That said, anyone shipping Wincest really doesn't have the moral high ground in the argument.

I'm sorry you think you have the moral high ground here.

I'm appalled that you think you do so we're totally even.

Because something we like in fandom TOTALLY correlates to something we like in real life.

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