Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2019-07-10 07:08 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2019-07-10 07:08 pm
[ SECRET POST #4569 ]
⌈ Secret Post #4569 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
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Notes:
Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 18 secrets from Secret Submission Post #654.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
Re: Full text
(Anonymous) 2019-07-11 12:08 am (UTC)(link)Well, with fandom we don’t even have to probe all that deep to see how fandom has taken the place of where G*d used to be. Fandom uses some of the same words (canon) to describe the same processes that beset Christianity throughout its history: different interpretations of texts begot legions of followers of varying piety.
This is sort of a facile argument - the fact that fandom has inherited certain words from religion just is not really strong evidence that fandom functions as a religion, and there's no argument really being made to show that it does. In particular, there's nothing that goes towards the specific idea of fandom fulfilling the kind of specific post-Nietzschean ideological function of religion. And I would argue that the way that the word 'canon' is used in fandom largely as a marker of a kind of hermeneutical or interpretative approach (albeit an approach that largely came to exist in religious contexts), not in some kind of a scriptural sense or anything like that. Also, I think it's significant to note that a lot of the most acrimonious arguments in fandom are in large part connected with social or political issues or ideas that aren't unique to fandom qua fandom.
This is where fascism comes in... Fascists have their own ships and canons, but unlike fandom, they actually strive to acquire the ships and cannons needed to effect their interpretations of the world into reality... The liberal bourgeoisie’s culture industry has (for now) sufficiently satiated their hunger. But fascists are (or rather have) taken state power to start genociding.
This is just, like... completely bizarre. Like it's not even necessarily wrong but it's just such a completely, completely weird way to frame the idea.
So like... OK. Yes, it's broadly true that fascists want to take power to instantiate their ideological visions and goals in a violent, forceful way. But there's no particular relationship between that & fandom except in the most absolute broad sense. The simple fact that you want to take some set of ideas, whether that's a set of interpretations of canon or an overarching ideological worldview, and turn it into something that exists in reality is a basic feature of human civilization in general. It's not in itself distinct to fascism. There has to be some much more detailed grounds for the comparison.
(I will say that I think there is a strong argument that overarching ideologies can play the kind of pseudo-religious role that the post contemplates earlier, so there could theoretically be a connection there, but I think it's a very tenuous one and you would need to do a ton more work laying it out)
Considering the prophylactic phrase for a moment: absent g*d (again, that’s over), without mass culture, what do you think fandummers would be doing if they didn’t have drama over slashfics to preoccupy them? Where would all that libidinal energy go if the stream of slop from marvel or netflix were cut off? If all this masscult weren’t dulling the swinery throughout fandom into accepting their miserable, alienated lives in exchange for another marvel movie or another pokemon game as late capitalism necrotizes around them, who do you think is waiting with a ready-made answer for why they can’t enjoy their precious shows, games or movies?
I don't think this stuff is very theoretically interesting or novel so I'm not really going to reply to it unless someone really thinks it's, like, a great point that needs to be answered.
I think overall, the post just does not do a good job of elucidating the specific nature of fandom and how they connect it to fascism. I don't think it even comes close. Even if the argument were better made, I'd be really skeptical of it, because fandom just doesn't make the kind of broad all-embracing totalitarian ideological claims that fascism does.
Re: Full text
(Anonymous) 2019-07-11 01:07 am (UTC)(link)Yes, "entertainment is the opiate of the masses" and fandom is just horny women looking for a fix. Never mind that shipping originated as a critique of patriarchy and heterosexism in mass media, and fans were the only people who considered that media worthy of the same kinds of critique as the official canon of Nietzsche's peers. Then there's the substantial overlap between people who do Marvel and Pokemon and the people who support radical feminist (not terf) and queer work.