[ SECRET POST #4762 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #4762 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 44 secrets from Secret Submission Post #682.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

But how was Kylo Ren's turn "an unselfish change of heart"? I find it hard to fgure out why he changed back, except for his mom calling him by his original name and touching him with the force?

And with you re: Anakin's redemption - it was mostly bullshit and there was zero evidence that he changed in any way. So his force ghost presence at the end was completely unearned. It just didn't bother me that much because I watched it as a kid, and considered it to be a quasi-fairytale. Never thought about it seriously until teh prequels came (which I think is the mistake; SW are not meant to be taken too seriously, they make little sense).

[meadowphoenix]

his was a much longer turn i think which helps. his mom started it and his dad finished, but essentially there was no actual reward to turning his life around. he wasn't going to get anything you could think he wanted or anything he could want post-turn by turning. he just...doesn't gain anything he could possibly know he was going to gain beforehand. it was literally "oh im a dummy let me stop being a fascist" which is pretty altruistic. but you're right that a lot of that is like text interpretation, lmao.

I mean I think "thinks the darkside gives a fuck about his wife/children or that even if it did, his wife/children would appreciation the death and murder that preceded it" is greek tragedy which is the same narrative tradition as the OT ((space) opera is so OTT so that I'm not sure "takes itself seriously" is the right gauge), so i don't think the tone is actually different. but i agree we're really only having a serious conversation on anakin's redemption because they decided to give him a motive beyond evil, and people invested in the post-OT extended universe.

[(Anonymous)]

AYRT

Oh, yes, definately, we wouldn't be talking about Vader's redemption if the prequels weren't there. It was generally easy to gloss over, considering it was the end of the story for a long while.

What I miss re: Kylo/Ben/whatever we chose to call him in regards to his character arc is his motivations, as an actual person, and as in actually stated. Because it's sort of mostly working on the mythical/magical level, with dark force influences (Snoke/Palpatine) and light force influences, but then his conversation with his dad is an attempt to work it on a human character level, but I'm simply not getting why he did decide not be evil at this particular point, beyond "magic touch" touched him, which they aren't really fully committed to either (but it's all tied to "I'm not sure what was so tempting for him in the dark side, except evil magic touch something", which is ok, I guess, for a myth, but then they gave him the whole Luke betrayal thing as an actual reason for his final turn, so now it's neither this nor that, and it just doesn't add up into a fully realised character in any way. I can't make heads or tails out of him without adding a lot extra stuff to what was shown on screen).

[meadowphoenix]

im completely with you. main characters need some internalization for fucks sake, especially for film and like i feel like motivation is step 1 of characterization and I still don't fucking know what ben or kylo wanted. and nothing i think about meshes with other actions he takes and so yeah his redemption notes are very hollow. its a mess, and its sad that that's still more fully realized than anyone else's character.