[ SECRET POST #4922 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #4922 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 57 secrets from Secret Submission Post #705.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

There are biological women and there are trans women, two separate groups. Biological women menstruate, unless there's a condition that prevents them to. Trans women don't, because their reproductive system isn't the same as that of a biological woman's. This is basic biology.

It looks like you're trying to muddle the categories, and I wonder why?

[(Anonymous)]

You have trans women and cis women and both are women. Some women are trans women, who don't menstruate, and some women are cis women, who menstruate. So to say that women as a whole menstruate is incorrect. Woman is not synonymous with cis woman.

[(Anonymous)]

Also, some women are cis women who don't menstruate, and some people who menstruate aren't women. When talking about menstrual health, "all cis women" just doesn't cover it.

[(Anonymous)]

How did pointing out that the only people who can menstruate are female become "TERFs don't acknowledge cis women who are infertile/born without ovaries/with PCOS/or whatever"?

[(Anonymous)]

NAYRT but the problem is that's not the point that JKR ended up making in context. Insisting that one should describe people who menstruate as "women" and that describing them as "people who menstruate" is wrong does seem to open one up to this critique. That's the point that JKR attempted to make: that you should say "women" instead of "people who menstruate". And at that point, you're no longer making the argument that all people who menstruate are biologically female, you're making the argument that the terms "women" and "people who menstruate" are interchangeable, and they're not. And it's quite relevant to point out that women and people who menstruate are not identical groups and that there are several different groups who fit into one category or the other but not both, including cis women who don't menstruate as well as trans men and trans women.

It's possible that this is a result of JKR specifically being muddle-headed and not a problem with the arguments of anti-trans feminists more generally. I couldn't say (I suspect that JKR didn't actually pay attention to the context and was making a different, and also transphobic, argument badly). But either way, to gloss JKR's argument as "only people who are biologically female can menstruate" is inaccurate given the context, because that's not the argument she actually made, even if it's the argument she would like to have made and you would like her to have made.

[(Anonymous)]

SA I apparently deleted a sentence when I was editing this post - the context of the original discussion was sanitary supplies for people who menstruate. So insisting that you can use "women" instead of "people who menstruate" in that context really does seem to indicate that you think the two terms are precisely interchangeable.

[(Anonymous)]

Because that's not true.

[(Anonymous)]

"The only people who can menstruate are female" is a false statement. Trans men are male and some of them menstruate.

[(Anonymous)]

Okay, no. 'Male' isn't the same thing as 'man' or 'masculine'. 'Male' and 'female' refer to biological sex. Trans men are men, but if they were male then they wouldn't be trans men, they would be cis men.

[(Anonymous)]

NAYRT

You are correct, but "The only people who can menstruate are women" would be a false statement and "Trans men are men and some of them menstruate" a true one

[(Anonymous)]

For sure! I just feel like the conversation about what exactly "woman" means is fraught enough as it is, and it doesn't help anyone to start confusing that with biological terms that are way more straightforward. Saying "Some men menstruate" is both true and relevant, whereas saying "Some males menstruate" is just flat-out wrong unless we're getting into the realm of science fiction.

[(Anonymous)]

Ehhh, no, male/female is used on identification documents (and not just birth certificates), so it's not strictly a biological definition at all.

[(Anonymous)]

The fact that it's used on ID documents doesn't mean it's not a biological term, it means the people who created the categories on those documents were either aiming for the biological distinction, or didn't know or care about the difference between sex and gender. The category on passports for example is explicitly labelled 'sex', not 'gender', in English.

Trans people have existed throughout human history, but gender identity as a *legally recognised* concept separate from and in many situations more important than physical sex is relatively recent in modern western society and a lot of documentation hasn't caught up yet.

[(Anonymous)]

You know what biological women and trans women have in common? They're both women.

What is something not all women have in common? Menstruation. Why use the general term if you're only talking about a specific subset suffering from a thing that's specific to said subset? Just use the specific term.

You're even making the distinction between different types of women in your comment. So you acknowledge that there are different types of women with different biological traits but you object to other people acknowledging that fact?

[(Anonymous)]

but what about transmen?

[(Anonymous)]

Very bold of you to think TERFs give one single shit about transmen (though of course said men wouldn't be welcome in those sacred womb spaces, either, because as men, they look and act like men)

[(Anonymous)]

See also:

https://www.shatnerchatner.com/p/as-a-trans-man-thanks-for-being-so

[(Anonymous)]

No one gives a shit about trans men. How many times have you heard about trans women campaigning for their brothers when they are shouting for their rights? Not too fucking often.

[(Anonymous)]

yes they do

[(Anonymous)]

lol that shows how much you know. You really gotta go beyond your tiny circle of terf knowledge and use google once in a while. Not that you are capable of changing your mind :)

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah no, nice fucking try.

[(Anonymous)]

Show some fucking receipts where trans women advocate for anything that doesn't benefit them or STFU

[(Anonymous)]

but terf-chan :( if we showed you receipts you would be wrong :( and where will your high ground go terf-chan? WHERE WILL IT GO??

[(Anonymous)]

terf-chan

Why are so many trans people otakus?

[(Anonymous)]

Source: every fucking trans person I know.