Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2008-12-07 04:57 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2008-12-07 04:57 pm
[ SECRET POST #702 ]
⌈ Secret Post #702 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
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Notes:
CITY STUFF → http://lolbuttsex.myminicity.com/
Secrets Left to Post: 17 pages, 403 secrets from Secret Submission Post #100.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 1 2 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 - too big ], [ 1 2 - repeat ], [ 1 2 - doing it wrong ], [ 1 - posted twice ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
no subject
He, however, gives me the creeps. Every role I've seen him in as been uber-super-creepy. Even the Marquis, who I loved in the book. I don't know, maybe it's the eyes, maybe it's the sneer, but he's just one of those people who makes me skin crawl, like John Travolta or Nicholas Cage.
Although I think it's kind of hilarious how if you don't want him for the part, it's because you're a racist. I mean, I'm pretty sure that assuming people don't like a black actor because he's black is more racist than not liking a black actor because you just don't like him. (Well, not for that role, anyway. He plays fantastic baddies--Benjamin was just sooo deliciously slimy. And not half sexy. But still super-super creepy.)
Though I will admit...I was hoping for 11 to be ginger. But then, it would probably be funnier if it were 13 anyway.
no subject
Isn't it racist to say that about him? I personally think it could be. What if the actor himself was born white and still put into the role of this show? What you be thinking then? Would he still be "creepy" or would he look normal to you? You don't have to answer me on this but at least think about it.
no subject
How is it racist to say I find him creepy? If race is immediantly where your mind goes, then I think it's you, not me.
Me finding him creepy has nothing to do with his race, and everything to do with the roles I've seen him play (as I said before):
1) Marquis de Carabas. My favourite character in Neverwhere, but he's still a cold, frightening, calculating jerk that you wouldn't trust unless you could see both of his hands. He named himself after a fairytale lie.
2) The random one-shot in an earlier Doctor Who who played a lethal game of Weakest Link against Rose. Again, calculating, with no regards to others. More forgiveable, because only one person would leave alive, but he was really freaking smug about it.
3) "Benjahmihn" (and I'm one of the few people who liked his American accent) in Jekyll. Out of all the bad guys, Benjamin is the only character with no redeeming features whatsoever. He's slimy, smarmy, etc.
He's just really good at playing these roles. Did I say he doesn't "look normal?" Yes, part of it is his face. Not his ethnicity, but the little sneer he usually has, that cock to his eyes that says "I'm better than you and slightly disgusted by your stupidity."
But frick, if he'd been born white, he'd be someone else. But whatever his race, if he played those roles like that, with that sneer and that cold look in his eye, then yes I would still find him creepy.
Man, if Nicholas Cage had been born black, would I still find him creepy?
Again, I still think it's much more racist on your part that I have to justify being creeped out by him because he's black, but I don't have to justify being creeped out by Nicholas Cage. The fact that you jumped on this and assumed that me saying that I don't mind a black Doctor (gee, that would probably be the part that means, well, that I don't care if the beloved character is black or white!), but that I do not like that particular actor (for the role, anyway). I said that, and you counter with "You don't link him because he's black!"
What I love is that, it doesn't matter what justification I could offer. I could point out that my favourite character was Mickey Smith, that I think Noel Clarke was the sexiest actor in the show (cheeky little so-and-so. Love him.), and that he will be the only reason I'll bother watching series three of Torchwood (or that if there were a convincing way to explain the Doctor looking exactly like a member of his supporting cast, Noel would have my insta-vote to be 11), but hey, it's just me pretending to be not racist to excuse the fact that there's this one actor that I simply don't feel is right for the part. ZOMIGOSH, the only reason for the must be because he's black!
Do you, or do you not, see the problem with assuming something that assinine from one single freaking sentence?
You went ahead and believed that I was one of those "I'm not racist but..." people from my one sentence statement... I'm gonna go ahead and assume that you're one of those people who loves to start drama and take offense at things that are clearly not offensive (like eh-heh-ver-y one who complained about the freaking Princess and the Frog. What, really, people? You didn't hear Cajuns complaining, and we're the ones who got the short stick with the fricken firefly). And if I sound pissed, it's only because I think that it's people who act like that who wind up actually slowing down the progress of the world being colorblind.
Just saying.
no subject
First off, I am sorry for assuming that you're racist. I just get very offended when people comment how a character looks creepy and how he happens to be black. Yes, I do jump to conclusions too soon but I have dealt with seeing a lot of racist people my whole life and it's really sickening. And just the way you worded your earlier comment on the "Well I like black doctors but blahblahblah" in a sort of way. I'm not saying you did say it like that but it just sounded very similar.
How am I racist that I want you to justify that you are not racist? I was just curious on your own personal thoughts. That's all. But thank you for answering my question though.
Also, I really wanna watch Princess and the Frog because for starters, I love Disney movies, secondly I love 2-D animation and thirdly the main character is a beautiful, loveable woman and hopefully this will be a great movie to remember for a lifetime.
no subject
And as a Cajun...well, the firefly kind of bothers me, because with everyone making sure the film was PC enough in one direction, no one gave two craps about that. But I'm still thinking it'll be fantastic.
How am I racist that I want you to justify that you are not racist? I was just curious on your own personal thoughts.
My thinking is basically that if someone says "I don't like this actor," and the actor happens to be black, and someone else immediantly assumes that the person doesn't like that actor because he's black, that the someone else's mind goes straight to race. If I have to justify not liking one actor, but not others, then it's still a different treatment based on skin color.
BTW, I'm not sure if it was a typo or anything, but having a black Doctor is not the same thing as "black doctors." The Doctor is...important. He's been an icon for almost half a centry. So I really like the idea of him being black if the actor is right. I don't think he is. I'm worried that if he's picked, the role will be written to play to his strengths (because that's what they do for all the actors) and his best roles are cold, uncaring, smug creeps.
no subject
Tiana is a beautiful name and it's not degrading for this character unlike how Maddy and her being a chambermaid would've been.
You do realise that the Snow White and Cinderella movies were made way before the feminist movement, right? And that Walt Disney was one of the most sexist and racist people on the planet? Don't get me wrong, I love those movies because I like the female characters themselves but I didn't like the situation they were put in. Snow White had to clean and cook for seven, dirty, gross, smelly men and Cinderella did the same for three bitchy women who pretty much abused the hell out of her. I'm honestly surprised neither of them went freaking crazy and try to kill people. These two having to be maids is also offensive.
And wow, you're actually pissed that people are offended by the early production of Princess and the Frog when it did obviously had racist ideas? They have every right to be and so do I. You don't have to offended honestly but you need to at least understand why people wouldn't have liked Princess and the Frog had Disney not changed it.
no subject
If a story is told well, and if there's no racist motive behind it, then I don't see why people get up in arms. It just seems like a lot of people want another excuse to get mad and yell at whoever for not being super-sensitive enough.
I mean, heck, they got so worked up, they couldn't call it the Frog Princess because somehow that was offensive. You have to really really work hard to be offended by that, I'm sorry.
My understanding was that it took place in Jazz Age New Orleans, so it would've fit with the history. It's not racist to play into the time period it was set in, especially since it was supposed to be a rags to riches story like many many many fairy tales before it.
I think it's silly to get offended over stories that are well-told and well meant and meddle and say, no, we need to censor this and fix that and bland it out as much as possible. So Tiana will go from being royalty to ...some kind of trouble...to being royalty again, which really is just a less compelling story than a classic rags to riches American dream type story.
I don't see why anyone should be offended over Cinderella and Snow White. I think Cinderella was stupid to stay in that position for so long, but I don't think it's sexist and offensive. I don't even think I should find it offensive. It's not saying "hey, women, you belong on your hands and knees scrubbing." It's saying, "hey, here's this girl who had to go through some tough crap. And she did, and she took the bad times with grace (in the gender-neutral sense of the word), and persevered, and she totally won out in the end, and she had that to throw in the faces of the people who'd made her life miserable."
Given that Snow White and Cinderella are classic princess stories that, in the old stories still involved them cooking and cleaning, even if they were made today, they'd still be doing it. Heck, Enchanted had Giselle cleaning house as well (and since Giselle is supposed to be a quintessencial Disney Princess, well, seems like it's semi-standard, at least). I mean, you just know there are going to be groups who are pissed off with this movie however it goes. "Oh, the Prince is black--what, black girls should marry black men?" "Oh, the Prince is white--what, black princes aren't good enough for Disney Princess?" "Oh, she needed to be saved at this one point by a man" etc. PC groups do this for everything, race, gender, religion, and it just needs to stop, because it hinders more than it helps.
It's like how Song of the South will never be shown in America because it made "slave life" (well, sharecropper life, but similar enough) look idyllic. But it was a beautiful movie, first of it's kind, brought forth classic songs, retold stories that had come and adapted all the way from Africa, and James Baskett was the first black man to recieve an Oscar. Or like banning Huck Finn because of the slavery (missing the point of the book entirely). And it's not hard to see, well, given the time period it's set in coupled with the time period it was made in, that it's going to have some off-putting elements to it. But it didn't make it a bad movie, worthy of being banned.
When people get worked up over things like this because GASP, a black girl in 1920 New Orleans was a chambermaid at the start of the story...well, all I can figure is it's that kind of attitude more than any latent racisim on Disney's part that made it take so very long to finally get a black Princess.
Yes, Disney was a racist, sexist guy. And in spite of that, he and his company have made some of the most beautiful, timeless movies ever. And while I get that there was a time when Uhurah was novel because she was a black woman on television who wasn't a maid, I don't see why now, when we can have generally awesome characters portrayed by people of any race, why it is so offensive that she start as a chamber maid if it's in that particular time period. It wasn't offensive with Cindy...it shouldn't be offensive now.
no subject
(Anonymous) 2008-12-08 04:30 am (UTC)(link)no subject
However, with a little bit of time and plenty of soul searching, I was able to set aside my feelings of creeped outedness; not quite soon enough to ever really get into him as 9, mind you, but I was at least able to withstand his brief arc on Heroes.
Maybe in time you'll be able to do the same.
no subject
It's a little worrying, not exactly a ringing endorsement that you were finally about to withstand his short time on Heroes. I'm kind of worried about having a Doctor that I just can't get into. I got into Six, for crying out loud. I accept that there's a transition period, but Ten had me hooked in one episode. I don't want to spend a whole season going "Well, he's...um...eh..."