fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #760 ]

[ SECRET POST #760 ]

⌈ Secret Post #760 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

101.

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102.

[Battlestar Galactica]

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103.

[Anderson Cooper]

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104.

[Hayate the Combat Buttler, Nagi and the Student Council Trio]

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105.

[Smallville, Supernatural]

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106.

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107.

[Nabari no Ou]

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108.

[Heroes and 'Gute zeiten, Schlechte Zeiten']

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109.

[Hellboy 2]

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110.

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111.

[Bleighton]

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112. [repeat]

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113.

[Psych, Dexter]

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114. [repeat]

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115.

[Supernatural]

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116.

[High School Musical]

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117.

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118.

[PGSM RPFS Keiko KitagawaXAyaka Komatsu]

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119.

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120.

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121.

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122.

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123.

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124.

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125.

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126.

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127.

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128.

[resized, not repeat]

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129.

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130.

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131.

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132.

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133.

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134.

[Kimi wa Petto]

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135.

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136.

[Scrooged]

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137.

[Avatar]

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138.

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139.

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140.

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141.

[Ghostbusters]

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142.

[katemodern]

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143.

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144.

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145.

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146.

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147.

[The Terminator/T2: Judgment Day]

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148.

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149.

[Lordi]

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150.

[Left4Dead]

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151.

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152.

[Tokio Hotel]

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153.

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154.

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155.

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156.

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157.

[Phoenix Wright/Ace Attorney]

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158.

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159.

[Kodomo no Jikan]

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160.

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161.

[Avatar, Stormbenders]

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162.

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163.

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164.

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165.

[Friendly Hostility]

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166.

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167.

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168.

[Being Human]

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169.

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170.

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171.

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172.

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173. [not a secret]

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174.

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175.

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176.

[Hugh Laurie/Stephen Fry; House/Wilson]

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177.

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178.

Notes:

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Secrets Left to Post: 11 pages, 264 secrets from Secret Submission Post #109.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 4 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 4 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

You seem to be missing my point. I have no problem with them writing it, I have a problem with the circlejerk attitude that comes with it. And they need to read a few books a cite a few sources, then I might respect what they write a bit more.

Basically, you want "fandom" discussions to become even more like academic discussions, to the point where they are incomprehensible to anyone who hasn't done to required reading?

No, that would involve reading a lot of books and citing a lot of sources. I just want them to actually know what the hell they're talking about, rather than just acting like they do.

Now I'm curious -- which discussions are you referring to?

metafandom

Yeah, I know; but which discussions on

metafandom are you talking about? The recent blow-up over race doesn't exactly seem a) lacking in academic credentials or b) focused on "new territory." The people involved seem to be very aware of just how often these issues pop-up.

There were a couple of essays within the current race scandal that were the straw that broke the camel's back for me, but I agree that the large amount of it is not as bad as some of the shit I've seen in the past.

They're already like that.

But that's exactly what I'm saying: that circlejerk attitude is everywhere in fandom. It's part of appeal of fandom. They're talking about serious topics (sometimes), but in the context of something that is decidedly not Serious Business. While it's true that they might not be winning any Nobel prizes for the ideas they're tossing around, in the end it's about doing something that they enjoy, not about being groundbreaking.

In any case, it's rather presumptuous of you to assume that, just because they're discussing things that you personally find uninspired, they don't read any books. Heaven knows that I read a great deal of nonfiction covering a wide array of different topics, and my ideas are still uninspired.

It may be part of the appeal for you, but it's one of the most unappealing aspects of fandom to me.

And I can assume they don't read any books because of the way they talk, between themselves, as if they are covering new ground, when I know for fact that they are not.

That may be true, but that begs the question: Why should they have to conform to your preferences? If you don't like it, you don't like it. But posting inflammatory secrets about them is hardly going to change the preferences that you despise.

Sometimes it's fun in a discussion to approach things as if they're novel; sometimes, it can make the discussion more exciting. It's still presumptuous (not to mention arrogant) to assume that you know more than they do by simply observing their interactions with each other over a meta post, of all things. The way that a person gets her fandom kicks may or may not have anything to do with her chosen reading material. Now, if that person were in a more academic setting, like a college or university, your judgments would make more sense.

Sorry, I thought the whole point of this secret thing was for people to be able to get things off their chests without revealing the information to the people they feel stop them from doing so. I stated my opinion and my reasoning, and I feel better for it. I have not, subsequently, gone over to metafandom and linked them to the secret and the several threads on here agreeing with it. Obviously that would be the only goal of me making such a secret. I must lead the revolution!

It is not one single meta post, it's hundreds, which revolve around each other, agreeing and agreeing and agreeing. They write essays, they link to essays, they talk about their experiences and the other essays that have been linked but they never talk about published theorists. Forgive me if that leads me to believe they haven't read anything by those theorists - from now on I shall just assume they are lazy, or omitting them deliberately instead.

And I am expressing an opposing opinion, with my reasoning, and feel better for it. Bully for me, I guess? Pointing out what I believe to be the absurdity and presumption of your secret does not mean I think you don't have the right to post it. But I was presumptuous for assuming you intended to initiate any changes by posting the secret, so I apologize.

Draw whatever conclusions you wish; it makes those conclusions no less presumptuous. I fail to see how it's surprising that fans might wish to keep their fandom discussions within the context of, well, fandom.

I think, unfortunately, we are going to have to agree to disagree. Otherwise I can only see this discussion cycling endlessly, which would be a waste of time.

Agreed.

different anon

But posting inflammatory secrets about them is hardly going to change the preferences that you despise.

that's what you said.

you essentailly indicate that the secret poster should have kept their mouth shut instead of making a secret that bugs them. you're so butthurt, do you meta~~wank~~fandom?

Pointing out the futility of an action now means that I'm telling someone to shut up? I'll bear that in mind.

I do not metafandom, as it happens. (I don't even lurk there.) I was responding to the content of the OP's secret alone, without any bias in either direction. By their secret alone, the OP came off as very self-righteous, and that rubbed me the wrong way. Looking at metafandom, I can kind of see where he or she is coming from--but the secret still strikes me as holier-than-thou. So while I wasn't 'butthurt', I was annoyed. There's a difference.

Hi, I'm the anon from earlier in the thread.

they never talk about published theorists. Forgive me if that leads me to believe they haven't read anything by those theorists - from now on I shall just assume they are lazy, or omitting them deliberately instead.

I guess I was right. You do want to limit fandom discussions to academics, to people who've read theory (not books, not articles but theory) and can properly cite those works. Talking about your own experiences and your personal reactions to other people's opinions apparently isn't enough. In order to participate in a fannish discussion you need... what? A bachelors degree? A couple hundred hours of research time logged? A personal library of at least two hundred books?

I guess this is all moot, though. This post won't have any citations, so you won't be able to take me seriously.

Hello there, slippery slope.

They write and act like qualified sociologists, like experts, yet do not appear to have the reading to back it up. I do not want to limit such discussions to academics unless they already hold themselves to be such. Please look up the meaning of 'armchair expert'.

I do not want to limit such discussions to academics unless they already hold themselves to be such.

But I haven't seen anyone claim to be a sociologist. Nor has anyone brought up academic standards of discussion, except for you. Yes, the tone has been largely formal and... hyper-intellectual, but that's par for the course during fandom discussions.

I think that the problem is that you want these conversations to turn into complex theoretical discussions, while most of fandom is pretty happy to keep formal sociology on the periphery, while concentrating on their opinions and experiences. They're simply less interested in theory than they are in the actual subject of the discussion.

And yet with the subjects they bring up and their subsequent opinions, they are largely reiterating existing theories and then, usually, acting like they have happened upon something new. Perhaps I am bias, coming from an academic perspective, but it does bother me when the prior stated behaviour happens and I have studied the exact same sociological theory the week before.

Personally, I don't mind how complex or theoretical the discussions are, but when they are already complex theoretical discussions (by which I mean any essay that brings up post-colonial or feminist theory, both of which are drawn on practically daily on metafandom, depending on the current 'theme') then yes, I would like to see a little more research and a little less 'someone is wrong on the internet'.

In a simple example, ignoring the implications of semiology: if I happen upon a group of people discussing the colour of the sky, going around and around and largely repeating themselves, telling tales of when they saw a particularly beautiful sunset, sunrise, thunder storm, clear sky, etc etc, I do, unfortunately, feel somewhat bothered that they are, essentially, talking about the colour blue and yet have not once used, acknowledged or made vague reference to the already existing word blue.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #760 ]

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