[ SECRET POST #5287 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #5287 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 25 secrets from Secret Submission Post #756.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

04. https://i.imgur.com/aBXTrBQ.png

[(Anonymous)]

I guess something about the character rubs them the wrong way and they feel the need to express that somehow. But yeah, I don't really get going on and on about a character one hates either, especially if it's in a serious story and nothing meant to be satirical.

[sparklywalls]

If I really don't like a character to the point of not really wanting to include them seriously, I simply find a way to not include them in my story. Even with characters that aren't my favourites, I pride myself in trying to write them in character.

Maybe I'm exposing myself as a fandom old, but I really don't get and will never get the trend for dedicating as much time to something you hate as something you enjoy. I know character bashers were always there, but it seems to take up way too much time for some people these days.

OP of the comment for the secret.

[(Anonymous)]

And many of these characters actually have some pretty bad canonical flaws a writer can stick to and have the character be unlikeable and in character, without making the character the awfullest awful to ever awful.

I know character bashers were always there, but it seems to take up way too much time for some people these days. Yes, and so much effort, too.

Thanks to the secret maker!

[(Anonymous)]

I really like the way you've designed the secret for my comment. It hits (heh) just right.

[(Anonymous)]

I try not to think too hard about the motivations of the authors too much, since I know many authors in fandoms especially ones like HP are young and they want X or Y to happen but they don't know how to do it plausibly without making the 'canon love interest' let's say, into a villain and an extreme over the top villain at that.

Then again, you are going to have 'stans' of those characters who are more than willing to jump into the comments and accuse any writer who writes their favorite character in a negative light in ANY way, even if it is in character, as "character bashing." Sometimes making me wonder why they're in the 'rival ship' tag if they want positive portrayals of their faves. Ah well.

[(Anonymous)]

Possibly a slightly off-topic rant, but I used to really REALLY hate this way back in the M7 fandom. Particularly when it came to Nathan Jackson in Ezra-centric fic. Chris used to get it pretty bad too, occasionally everybody in a really woobie!Ezra fic, but Nathan just felt like he got hit with it the absolute worst. He’s just a caricature suspicious shrew of a man who lambasts Ezra and falsely accuses him at every possible turn.

And I do get that they have a troubled relationship in canon. It’s a western, Ezra is a southern gambler and conman, and Nathan is an ex-slave honest healer who deeply disapproves of cheating people. They are quite often on opposite sides of an issue. And Nathan, a couple of times, when badly triggered by current events (prostitutes potentially being sold in a mail-order bride scam that Ezra suggested, finding a Chinese woman in Ezra’s bedroom after she was literally sold to Ezra by her uncle earlier and Ezra turned the deal down), has slung some accusations around. It’s usually under pretty understandable circumstances, though.

But Nathan was also the guy who fixed Ezra’s shoulder not too long after Ezra refused to ride with him because he was black, and Ezra was firmly resisting treatment for apparently the same reason. Everyone talks about the episode where Ezra was trying to justify taking a LOT of money they found on an assassin for himself, talking about Nathan berating him, but Nathan mostly just reminds him that the money isn’t his. Josiah, struggling with his own demons, was the one who completely flew off the handle at Ezra and accused him there.

I did get the feeling, in a lot of the fanfic, that there was a bit of an impetus to make Nathan an unpleasant, holier-than-thou, occasionally treacherous person in fic to kind of … excuse the fact that Ezra was blatantly racist towards him in canon that one time. Not for long, despite his upbringing Ezra does wise up quick, but it’s definitely there. A lot of fic went out of its way to paint Ezra as an unjustly accused gentle soul, and that’s a bit harder to do when you have Nathan right there in canon gently or not-so-gently pointing out that he is, actually, a thief and a swindler who has some nasty hang-overs from a southern upbringing about him. And also a pretty soft-hearted man who loves children, gets shot helping people, and went back to help the team despite knowing he might get shot for first abandoning them. But you know. A guy can have layers.

It just used to really bug me a lot how bad Nathan got it in fic. Chris too, but I’m less protective of Chris, because he’s a bit of a dick and can handle his own self just fine. Nathan just got so much shit he didn’t deserve.

[(Anonymous)]

Poor Nathan. He was usually relegated to being awful to Ezra or bitching to people about their food choices. *sigh*

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah. He and Josiah tended to get shit on and/or ignored the worst, I think. Vin, Chris and Buck had the whole loyalty, old-friend-versus-new-soulmate thing going, Ezra's the cool gambler-with-a-heart-of-gold with the tragic backstory that periodically shows back up in the form of his mother, and JD at least gets his relationship with Buck to pull a few people in. But Nathan and Josiah are just treated like spare parts a lot of the time. Despite the fact that Nathan's an ex-slave and his relationship with Ezra was actually fascinating, and there was so much more that could have been done with Josiah and his sister, and possibly Josiah and Chris given that they have quite a few similar issues and coping mechanisms.

But, yeah. *sigh*

[(Anonymous)]

I don't know if some fans realize yet that all characters are words of fiction typed out by a writer, not actual people with consistent motivations or reasons for doing something annoying in the story. Like the same writer who wrote the character you like so much is also responsible for making the character you hate a lot. I mostly direct this opinion towards people who decide to be misogynistic to dubiously written female characters written by male authors.

SA

[(Anonymous)]

Also I think character bashing is a social thing. It feels performative. Like "look at us fans who are so cool and know better! We hate this character!"

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, I feel the same way.

I'm one of those people who is so deeply attached to my OTP it can be a little unhealthy, so I do actually understand the impulsive resentment of a character because they are "getting in the way" of your ship or whatever. But even then, I still find character bashing off-putting.

There were a few (not a ton, but a few) authors in the Sherlock fandom who went hard on Mary bashing, and it always rubbed me the wrong way, despite the fact that I was extremely ride or die for Johnlock at the time. I had no problem with making her a villain in fanfic, as long as she was actually a competent villain, and her motivation wasn't "being psychotic because John loved Sherlock more" or whatever. But there were some people who needed to character-assassinate her on every level. Not just make her a bad guy, but make her deranged, scheming, shriek-y, narcissistic, incompetent, and petty all at the same time. Hell, occasionally she'd even be characterized as a raging homophobe as well. It was a lot.

OP of the comment for the secret.

[(Anonymous)]

deranged, scheming, shriek-y, narcissistic, incompetent, and petty Yes, I see this a lot in all kinds of bashed characters, sometimes substituting in shouty for shriek-y and adding on murderous. It's just so excessive.

[(Anonymous)]

Yes, I always put "no character bashing" in my DNW for exchanges because sure, there's plenty of characters I dislike, but I dislike them for who they are, not some hyped-up super-evil parody of themselves. And the thing about character bashing is that it weakens the story and the other characters too.

[tabaqui]

I don't get bashing, either. Most any character that isn't a Mary Sue/Marty Stu has enough flaws in canon that you don't need to go over the top.

I really *despise* Willow from Buffy, but I tried as hard as possible to be fair to her in fic where she was just part of the story. I did kinda go after her in Changes, but I don't think you could call it 'bashing'...I didn't make her do or say anything that wasn't basically canon....

[(Anonymous)]

I've got characters that I absolutely despise, and if asked I could certainly explain and rant about how much I hate them... however for the most part, I don't. Largely because I don't actually want to devote much time to characters I hate, I'd rather just ignore them, perhaps complain with like-minded friends, and otherwise pretend they aren't a thing while going about my business. Much better use of my time.

[meadowphoenix]

I'll be the weirdo who really enjoys character bashing fic (both of my faves and my not-so-faves) lmao. Why? Because it actually clarifies why i like and dislike characters and to some extent why fandom likes and dislikes characters on the aggregate, and i think it's interesting to legit see people working through ethics? And I'm nosy and want to know how other people read/watch/hear things but don't want to ask. But my conclusion is that more OOC the bashed character is, the more likely the fave characters are ALSO equally OOC, and vice versa. So in other words most of this is wish fulfillment in response to intense feelings for fictional characters.

But to your point OP, some character bashing fic is solely in order to prop up the fave, and when they go completely OOC about it, that actually tells me what they like and dislike about the fave (in most fandoms it is tragic backstory). They character bash because they want to forcefully have their audience sympathize with their POV for the fic, and they don't know how to do that skillfully.
Some character bashing isn't OOC so much as the worst possible character traits and motivations turned up to 11. That's usually the authors who have flanderized the characters in their heads, so it's honest bashing. My fave bashing is bash-to-redemption, in which it starts out as bashing and then the bashed character redeems themselves. Quite frankly it often involves a ton of hypocrisy from the fave characters, but most of the time feels like the author is working through something. I think "working through something" is the reason for bashing quite a bit actually.

[(Anonymous)]

This is a really interesting take!

[(Anonymous)]

When I was younger there was a sense of solidarity in seeing a popular character that I hated get bashed. YES! I'm not alone! Someone else thinks they suck! Oh how I wish something unpleasant would happen to this character in the cannon and they would need to leave!

It was petty and mean spirited, but I'm glad I took out my adolescent angst on fictional characters rather than other fans or people in my life.

Nowadays I'm old and tired and I just don't want to read/talk/think about the characters I dislike. I don't care how involved they would realistically be with a plot I'll backbutton at the drop of a hat.