fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #5593 ]

[ SECRET POST #5593 ]

⌈ Secret Post #5593 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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[Malcolm in the Middle]

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[The Owl House]

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[Doctor Who (2005)]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 00 secrets from Secret Submission Post #800.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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How did you grow up in a conservative southern life and manage to learn what a trans man was before you learned that women in media weren't written like real women? I'm genuinely curious.

SA

The Hollywood liberal agenda, of course. I lived in the south, but Will and Grace was still on tv. And life in that culture is VERY binary. If you don't completely fit the mold of what SHOULD be, then you're obviously Not That.

I am, of course, using modern terminology. Back then, I thought of it as being a "man trapped in a woman's body", because that was the only frame of reference I had (very binary). From the TV, dontchaknow. Being asexual, I had no interest in men, but both southern culture and TV said that women were incomplete without men. Women are supposed to be a support to men, to give them comfort, to be rescued by them. They didn't do things, they had things happen to them. In real life, a girl's popularity and reputation in school lived and died on her boyfriend or her father (I was not popular, no BF, single mother). Almost my friends were male, and I do mean friends. While I would never have chosen to date anyone, I also wasn't given the choice as no one wanted to date me either. My deadbeat dad refused to help me apply for federal aid to college because I didn't need school, I just needed to find a husband. On TV, women only ever talked about men, and if they didn't, it was calculated to impress a man with how well she knew HIS subject of interest. I don't think I noticed anything passing the Bechdel test back then.

There were rarely if ever women on TV that weren't there to be a sexual object. Because I was more interested in exploring, doing science, saving the day, making things happen and being in an active role etc etc, I always identified with the male figures on TV. Male figures were also the only ones who could just be action or goal oriented, with no love interest/sexual object. Women were always primarily sexual objects. That was their purpose. I had no interest in sex, ergo I must actually be a man.

Then I moved to Portland for college. Met women who didn't have men and dating and relationships as endgame. And discovered asexuality. Then it dawned on me. Hollywood writers were mostly men, and they sucked at writing women.

SA

TLDR: Southern culture and Hollywood in the 90s had the same message. Women are for sex and love; men are for plot.

I had no interest in sex and love; all the interest in plot. Ergo, I must be a man.

DA
I am not even American, but same hat. A lot of people here had time in their life when they felt themselves being male. Some of this people aren't cis, but most of this people are cis usually queer women. TV (usually western because of course it is) and society tell you that you want to have romance, family and babies. Only men allowed to be something else

Somehow it just doesn't seem a logical leap for a conservative-raised 90s girl to go from "I'm not like the women I see on TV" to "I must be a man." (Hell, I was a liberal-raised 90s girl and I never thought me not wanting to grow up to romance and babies meant I was a trans man. Because even most liberals didn't know what trans was back then!) That kind of girl would think "Something must be wrong with me because I'm a girl who doesn't want the things women are supposed to want."

If this were someplace else, I might believe your story, but I'm with the other anon who thinks this is another subtle transphobic trolling attempt.

DA

And I agree as well.

DA - yeah, I was a conservative-raised girl in the 90s and figured that not being like the TV girls was a sign to dedicate myself to the church. Cis girls from less religious families trended towards "Maybe I'm a lesbian" or "maybe I'm just weird." Chaz Bono thought he was a lesbian in the 90s. AYRT is a not-so-subtle troll.

So your experience isn't similar to the first anon, so she must be a troll? Yeah, sure

SA

Believe what you want. IDIC and all that. Someone asked me to explain, so I explained.

DA from everyone around - Wow, what a horrible thing to say.

So apparently being a cis woman who didn't relate to femininity in the, I don't know, 80s means being a troll. What the fuck. Look at yourself condemning someone for being a non "feminine" cis woman, frankly.

This is how angry I feel when I read things like "this long dead person was obviously trans, even if she didn't think of herself as such". Because apparently others can tell how one feels about their gender on the inside lol.

Nowadays people are supposed to be either cis or trans so I say I am cis because I have to say something, choose pronouns, whatever. And then some people have the audacity of attributing gender to others. You asked for my opinion, I gave it, now you're saying I am wrong - what the fuck? Think about it.

DA here and not a US citizen; having been born in a poor country you can bet sexism was rampant in the past century (not that it isn't now) and I desperately wanted to be a man. I mean I sobbed when I had my period. I mean I felt joy when I was told I could do this and that under my social condition "if I was a man". Pretty sure some people would like to peg me as trans for that, when I was just really angry at the idea that, like the other anon said, being a woman meant I had to like romance, having sex with men, being a wife and having children and all that. I wanted to study, be successful and rich ON MY OWN and break the dumb mould imposed by my sex. I still do, but at least now I feel less alone in that since I found out about feminism and all that.

What the fuck are you even saying. What the fuck.

Also: Media was incredibly sexist too. I am sure this is what OP meant by media had me thinking I was a man on the inside - because they couldn't relate to women in the media. How do I know that? Me neither, and nowadays I also consider myself a queer cis woman. It's been hard. Thanks for stepping on our concerns. /s

So, like OP, Will and Grace literally made you think you were a man? Yeah, no. Not buying it. Go troll somewhere else.

Da but wow you're an asshole. Maybe if you actually listened to the very real experiences of people who grew up in an environment different from yours you wouldn't be so quick to jump down everyone's throat for being transphobic just because your anecdotal evidence doesn't align with theirs. But no, dismissing people because "well I didn't have that experience so you must be lying" is such an intellectually bankrupt thing to say.

I think the only troll here is you.

DA - I am going to assume you're a troll. Because otherwise you're being an absolutely massive asshole in the name of trans activism.

SA

You. You get it.

This was a really thorough, thoughtful, and genuine reply, and I applaud you for taking the time and emotional energy to write it, despite the grossly dismissive and insensitive way it was responded to by one or two individuals.

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[ SECRET POST #5593 ]

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