[ SECRET POST #6211 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #6211 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 31 secrets from Secret Submission Post #888.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

If these people still believe that people in prison deserve rehabilitation, then I think regular people that have never been imprisoned deserve a second chance and help more so than convicts.

[(Anonymous)]

That's the crazy thing, right? A lot of people are on board with the idea that if you break the law, even in truly egregious ways (e.g. violent assault), you should not be subject to cruel or eternal punishment. You should still be treated like a human being and be given the opportunity to reform.

But many of the same people see nothing wrong with permanently destroying the lives those who say or do the wrong things, or whose behavior falls into the "asshole" range but doesn't rise to the level of criminality. It betrays an inconsistent, unprincipled worldview. What is it about? Is it distance from the subject: they've personally known assholes (who hasn't), but they haven't known actual criminals? Is it status: they gain clout from piling on and denouncing certain people? Is it pleasure: they enjoy piling on, and launder that enjoyment through the profession of certain socially acceptable values? Is it a combination of all three?

[(Anonymous)]

ok but "doesn't get to be a famous genre author" is not equivalent to "subjected to the full horrors of an abusive carceral system"

prison abolition isn't important because no one should be held accountable things they do, it's important because prison is an atrocity and a keystone of power structures that conduct other atrocities

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, "prisons and what they do to prisoners are horrible and even from a pragmatic standpoint often make for worse outcomes than rehabilitation" =/= "no consequences for shitty behavior ever."

If tons of people were saying she should be jailed for this that would be one thing, but "publisher and agent dropped her like a hot rock" =/= prison time.

[(Anonymous)]

That isn't the issue.

The issue is believing that it's possible for criminals to be rehabilitated, but that people who say or do the wrong thing should be permanently denied the chance to reform. It's eternal consequence that's the problem, here, not the notion of consequences in general.

[(Anonymous)]

Except that you’re the only one talking about eternal damnation here, particularly in a case where the current span of eternity has been a few weeks.

[(Anonymous)]

Sorry but... that sounds all fine and dandy but where do prison abolitionists want violent rapists and murderers to go? Just let them off with community service?

[(Anonymous)]

From what I understand, they want them held in custody but not "prison" and dealt with on a case by case basis, because in their ideal world prisonless world, the amount of people who commit those crimes would be low enough for that to be possible. (I don't disagree with them in the long run, but we're talking probably several generations in which a massive societal reform takes place and happens to go perfectly, and I'm not sure what we're supposed to do in the meantime.)

[(Anonymous)]

What makes people think that "societal reform" will get rid of all violent people? Are they planning on breeding those impulses out of the species?

[(Anonymous)]

all of the data we have strongly supports the idea that violent crime reduces drastically if people consistently have their basic needs met and also don't have high levels of lead in the air

prisons on the other hand have consistently been proven to actually increase recidivism

[(Anonymous)]

But the notion at issue here isn't, "if you're against prison, then you must be against accountability." It's, "if you believe that prison-bound criminals can and should be rehabilitated, then it doesn't make sense to think that non-criminals should be permanently denied the chance to reform."