fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #6308 ]

[ SECRET POST #6308 ]

⌈ Secret Post #6308 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 52 secrets from Secret Submission Post #902.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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03. https://i.imgur.com/e3Lpdgt.jpg

LOOOOOLLLL. Yes they do! Not only do people TELL ficbinders to stop, there are campaigns to report them to get what they are selling taken down.

Babe. The Good Reads thing isn't about money it's about rudeness.

And we do tell off the book binders. I don't even *see* them and I hate them.

We do tell fic binders to stop it. And the goodreads thing isn't about the reviewers making money. It's about blurring the lines between books and fanfic. These two should be distinctly separate, not only for legal protection but because it's down right rude as fuck to review someone's hobby in a space meant for professionals.

So posting a review on Goodreads is blurring the line but binding a fic in a physical book is not?

Ficbinders are trash and plenty of fic writers and binders are quick to call them out.

But I think it’s hilarious you think reviewers don’t profit from Goodreads submissions!

The GoodReads thing is about treating fanfiction like professionally published books, holing fic to the same standards. If fic writers didn't like getting 'reviews' on ff.net, what makes people think they'd want someone reviewing their fic in a space that is meant for discussing professionally published books, a space where potential readers are looking at to see if the book is worth their time and money? And all the people who are going around saying fanfiction is a literary genre and should be given the same 'respect' as other genres are part of this problem. This is a direct consequence of trying to 'normalize' fanfiction. I feel the same way about people who write academic papers about fanfiction. GoodReads was always the next logical step in this movement to try to 'legitimize' fanfiction.

I feel like we've just gotten another step closer to that massive, ugly lawsuit that is going to drive a whole bunch of things underground again, perhaps for good this time.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2024-04-13 22:53 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2024-04-13 22:59 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2024-04-14 00:11 (UTC) - Expand

I mean the academic paper thing doesn't bother me if it's like... sociology 'examining a modern subculture/modern 'folklore'' angle, because it's not like an academic paper is getting out into the wider world. Like... an academic paper isn't a news article, my mother isn't going to read an academic paper unless it's directly applicable to her field (and, as she's retired, usually not even then).

But if I was teaching a lit class and someone turned in their thesis on a fic, I'm... not sure how I'd even handle that situation.

I would not say that writing academic papers about fanfiction is connected to "normalizing" it. Fanfiction is academically interesting precisely because it's not normal: it's an outgrowth of a subculture, with its own set of norms and taboos. And as it relates to human behavior and community formation, I don't see any reason why it should be exempt from study or analysis.

I suppose we'll just have to wait until somebody gets sued when a fanfic based on a corporation owned story is making money for someone who isn't said corporation, to illustrate why this is all a Bad Idea.

Man, I must be living under a rock because despite writing fic and being involved in fandom, I didn’t know either of these things were, well, a thing.

There have been no less than three secrets about it within the last week or so.

Even if you have been living under a rock, if you're a frequent enough visitor to F!S that you're commenting, I can't imagine you've not seen ANY of that wank.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2024-04-13 23:00 (UTC) - Expand

Man, this is making me miss the days of webrings and LJ/associated sites where you'd check out the master fic list and recs authors you liked/rec lists other people in your fandom made. Even Tumblr had those! Even now you can check out an AO3 account and see what fics they have bookmarked!

(I do miss the aesthetic and small summaries and "why I like this one" you could find in ship specific comms -- which even more back in the day (at least IME linked to other ships as well, in case you were into more than ship, as an affiliate).

and back when downloading a fic was...idk. for your personal use? I know some people request having their favorite fic bound, and for a while I was fine with that bc you're paying for the physical service and material for someone doing this for you. (if you're not learning how to do it yourself). As a fic writer, I think I'd be flattered you wanted my fic bound, and might be tempted to file off the serial numbers...but honestly, I don't know anymore. Just don't advertise your services like that! Like...fanfic is free for a number of reasons, the least among them not being "we cannot make money off of someone else's work or everyone is getting sued and all the fics get taken down". I feel like an old timer.

Whataboutisim. But what about bookbinding? That's bad!
I one day looked up a few old fics of mine and someone had put them on the goodreads website! I was very embarassed.

Why would you be embarrassed that somebody read your FICA and enjoyed them enough to recommend them to others?

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2024-04-14 19:52 (UTC) - Expand

...what?

Why in the world did you post it publicly at all if you find it embarrassing for people to talk and write about it?

Semi OT, but I had no idea people hated fic binders. Hating the ones selling on Etsy I get, but I always thought people making physical books out of fanfic was kind of neat. If it’s for their own personal use what’s the problem?

+1

I can absolutely see the ire in people ficbinding for profit, but most of the pics I've seen have been people binding fic for the authors of said fic as a gift, or for themselves to keep. Heck, I want to learn how to do it so I can have my favorite fics on the shelf and also baffle and embarrass my family once I die, and also ficbind my own stuff. Especially my own stuff!

Also this sounds like that same Goodreads wanker who had a secret posted earlier this week. Reviewing fic on Goodreads is still a shitty thing to do, OP.

OP

(Anonymous) - 2024-04-15 17:56 (UTC) - Expand

I think very few people hate fic binders that keep it. It's mostly the ones selling.

Yeah, to me there's a huge difference between someone paying money for something fandom-related for their own personal use (e.g., getting their favorite fic bound or commissioning a specific piece of fanart or a translation of something like a doujinshi that you would like to be able to read and understand) versus someone treating fandom as a mass-production commodity and selling mass-produced fic bindings or fanart or charging for access for their fandom-related translations.

The first (and only, because, well, I'm not a big fanfic reader) place I had seen fic binding was on r/bookbinding, and those always seemed to be gifts/commissions/personal use so I had no idea that it had become A Thing much less a hated thing.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2024-04-14 03:10 (UTC) - Expand

I don't use Goodreads much, but after hearing about the fanfic reviews they have, I went over to check it out, and all I can say is: Meh.

Talk reviews for the most milquetoast fanfic ever!

Most of it is just a bunch of reviews for the socially acceptable stuff I can find in the mainstream. Where are the reviews for crazy crossovers? And all the filthy, unapologetic, legally questionable porn (no, Fifty Shades of Grey doesn't count!)?

At least there's a good number of LGBTQ fanfic, but otherwise: Meh.

The real issue -- the one that becomes clear when you pay attention to what people say, including here on FS -- is the taboo against criticism. Since writing fanfiction is a hobby, something that people do purely for fun, the dominant paradigm is that it should not be critiqued, and the structure of a review (as opposed to a rec, which is positive by nature and very brief) is such that it's always going to contain some element of critique, even if it's mostly positive.

Bookbinding can definitely break another taboo: that of profiting off of fandom. However, bookbinding can itself be a fannish activity done purely for fun, so it's easier for people to imagine a dividing line between "appropriate" and "inappropriate" forms of bookbinding. It's harder to imagine such a line when it comes to writing reviews (especially when they're being written on a site dedicated to reviewing professional, as opposed to hobbyist, works).

A Goodreads but *only* for fanfic would stop this nonsense.

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