[ SECRET POST #1107 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1107 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

No need to leave comments like "HERE AGAIN SINCE IT WAS FORGOTTEN THE LAST TIME I SUBMITTED IT," please. It was not forgotten. You submitted it three times to the same submissions post.

Secrets Left to Post: 18 pages, 448 secrets from Secret Submission Post #159.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 4 5 6 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 4 5 - too big ], [ 1 2 - repeat ], [ 1 - take it to comments ], [ 1 2 - doing it wrong ], [ 1 - ships it ], [ 1 2 3 4 5 6 - posted twice ], [ 1 - text secret (PROTIP: YOUR SECRETS MUST GO ON AN IMAGE)], [ 1 - comment asking how to submit secrets (PROTIP: THERE IS AN FAQ)].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[modestroad.livejournal.com]

What's wrong with wanting her to walk again? I'm sure that most people in her situation would love to walk again and it's not because they are not happy with their lives now.

I don't want to see her wear the Batgirl cowl, but I do want to see her walk. People come back from the dead (Hal, Jason, Barry, Bart...) and somehow paraplegia is more permanent than death?

I love Barbara. I don't care if she's Batgirl or Oracle, I love her! And I hate to see her as a second to someone else. I would buy a book about Oracle any time, but DC will never publish such title-except if it's a mini series.

What's wrong with wanting my favorite DC character to be the protagonist for once? As Oracle she will never be that (no matter how I view things; in my head she's the lead in the new Batgirl book, not Steph).

[xanykaos.livejournal.com]

I'd say the big problem with making Babs walk again is that it's saying she's not "Good Enough" as she is. And the thing is, as she is, she's amazing. She is ten times more hardcore than she ever was as Batgirl. Honestly, as Batgirl, I saw her not as second, but third place at best (behind both Robin and Batman). As Oracle, she owns. Other people turn to her for help. She tells Batman what to do once or twice, and she doesn't take any crap from anyone. It's not because she's in a wheelchair, but the wheelchair was the catalyst. She does more as Oracle than she ever did as Batgirl.

And if you prefer Batgirl to Oracle, that's fine, but making her walk again is saying that she's less for being in a wheelchair. And there really aren't many disabled people as protagonists who aren't reduced to background characters.

[imagined-away.livejournal.com]

Or maybe I just want her to walk?
I love Oracle, I do. Barbara has always and will always be my favorite DC character. And I don't want her to be able to walk because I think her wheel chair makes her kick-ass any less. I was actually never more jealous of her then when I first read a comic where she fought with those pole things in her chair. I think that's a million times more awesome then jumping off of roofs with ziplines.
But I also remember a page, and I think it was right after she lost the ability to walk so maybe this has changed, where she said her favorite thing about being Batgirl was being able to *fly*, So Dick taped her legs together and took her up on the trapeze so she could fly again.
*That's* why I want her to be able to walk. Because she can no longer do something she loved. And that blows, five days after or 20 years later.

And no, Babs would never have become the women she is today without her wheel chair. That's completely true, it made her better and stronger. But it's not like if she could walk again (which I'm sure would take a shit load of hard work should anyone ever choose to write it), that would all disappear.

I'm not trying to be rude, and I'm sorry if any of this came off that way. I just always thought that Barbara got screwed in the worst way. *Not* because she ended up in a wheel cahir, but because whatever Moore says, I will always believe he intended for her to be "ruined" after TKJ. And I'm happier than I can say that Barbara showed them, and a writer was willing to give her amazing story lines.
Either way, wheel chair or no, Babs kicks ass. And she always will, whatever shit writers throw her way.
(My insane desire to cosplay as her is probably becoming more and more evident)

[xanykaos.livejournal.com]

Nah, I mean, I get what you're saying. There are characters that you like, and then there are characters that you love, that you want to be happy. I remember Babs used to love running too. And for the sake of her as a person, yeah, it'd be great to see her able to do the things she misses again.

But it's one of those things that just has Unfortunate Implications that could make it a bad move storywise, because even if the writer just thought "man, I want Barbara to be happy!" (and really, what writer these days actually thinks "hey, I want a character happy!"), there's still the implication, intentional or not, that being in a wheelchair made her Not Good Enough and that she needed to be fixed. Not so much if a fan feels that way, but it's one of the reasons I wouldn't want to see it canon.

[imagined-away.livejournal.com]

That makes much more sense.
As much as I love Barbara as Batgirl (and an entire lifetime of obsession for all things Bat started with her) I'd take her kicking ass as Oracle any day.
Haha, fair point. No comic writer wants their character to be *happy*. Where's the angst? Where's the drama? Where is the *suffering*?

[modestroad.livejournal.com]

I agree with what imagined_away said. I just wanted to say that in my post I made it perfectly clear that I don't want to see her as Batgirl. People often (9/10) think that I want to see her walk because I want to see her as Batgirl.

No! It's not that. I love her as Oracle and I love her as Batgirl, but I prefer her as Oracle. That's what I want to see; a walking Oracle. Because if she's hardcore now, she will bring to the word a new meaning if she ever walks.

Also I do believe that they are more storylines to explore with her walking; her relationship with Dick, Bruce, Jim. etc... There's a new generation of heroes that have never seen her walk or jump and only heard of people how good she was.

That's what I want to see. New storylines. I'm tired of watching the same things over and over again.

[isilrandir.livejournal.com]

If you look at it from a character perspective, having Babs walk again would completely alter her character. Right now, she's an invaluable part of the crime-fighting world, she kicks serious ass (mentally and physically), and she's completely unique as a character. And she does it all from a wheelchair.

There's nothing wrong with wanting her to walk again, except why would you? She's already a protagonist. Comics can have more than one, and Birds of Prey was definitely her book. They're bringing it back, so there's your Oracle book. Just because she's not on every page kicking people in the head doesn't mean she's less the star of the comic. If you haven't read Birds of Prey from the beginning, you should, because she gets plenty of kicking ass and taking names.

Right now, as she is, she's one of the strongest, most interesting characters in the DCU. She has adapted to her disability (which, I might add, she's had several chances to reverse which she did not take) and come out much stronger, and personally, I think she's a better role model as Oracle than she ever was as Batgirl.

[modestroad.livejournal.com]

Yes, I do agree. As Oracle she's more awesome. That's why I said in my post that I don't want to see her wear the Batgirl cowl again. People always assume that just because I want to see her walk I want to see her be Batgirl.

No, sorry. Not this fan. And why her walking will take away all character developement? You have a character, right? You walk, rigth? She doesn't need to be in the chair to be Oracle. The chair is not Hal's ring, it holds no power.

I've been reading comics for over fifteen years (I'm 28 now) and I find it ridiculous that in a world that the dead can come back to life Barbara is still in the wheelchair.

And I'm sorry, but as much as I love BoP and Dinah, BoP was never Babs book. It was both women. If you're okay with having her do the same things (sitting behind a screen) that's fine. But I know that the character can do a lot more than just that and I'm not happy.

[isilrandir.livejournal.com]

Fair enough, but I don't think Babs would stay Oracle if she could walk again. That's not really an argument for keeping her the way she is, obviously, and I sincerely doubt she'd take up the Batgirl costume again, but if she was physically able to go beat down bad guys, I think she would take the chance.

And I don't think that walking will take away her development as a character. I think if she had stayed Batgirl she would have lost out on a lot of development, but I certainly don't think that it would all disappear if she could suddenly walk again. I just really honestly don't see the point of it. She's a great, unique character the way she is; being paralyzed hasn't hampered her character growth, her ass-kicking, or her storylines.

I suspect we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one, though.