[ SECRET POST #1485 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1485 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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[image possibly triggery for self-injury]


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Notes:

Friending meme is still going!

Secrets Left to Post: 06 pages, 134 secrets from Secret Submission Post #212.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 1 and again 2 - repeat ], [ 1 - what ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[chixb4dix.livejournal.com]

You can't compare math and literature. You need math in everyday life. Classic literature, no.

[(Anonymous)]

Actually, you can compare math and literature, because many mathematical and scientific treatises are considered classic literature to Western culture.

What, do you think math just came out of nowhere, unrelated to any historical or philosophical context? Do you think literature and math are dichotomous un-related things? You do you want to abandon mathematics because so many mathematicians and physicists were rich white men?

[chixb4dix.livejournal.com]

Way to miss my point. It has become a theme in this thread.

If a person never studies math they can't use money (you know... buy shit like food and clothes?). That alone shows that in order to SURVIVE in our society, you need math.

Many people on the other hand never read classic literature and survive just fine.

If you can't see the difference, you're an idiot.

[(Anonymous)]

People "miss your point" because you don't seem to have one of any coherence at all. You just lash out and randomly insult everyone who dares to disagree with you and call them idiots.

You don't even have to study math in order to understand the concept of "buying things with money", so what exactly is your point? Yes, it's easy to survive without any awareness of 'the classics' of literature, history, art or culture.

If all you want to do is survive.

[chixb4dix.livejournal.com]

If you don't see my point the it's because you can afford to ignore it - it's called privilege.

You have to study math to handle math. How hard is that to understand?

[(Anonymous)]

You didn't say "handle math", you said "survive". I would ask you what you even mean by "handling math" in specific, but you know what? It doesn't matter. You speak almost entirely in unspecific weasel-words whose meanings change randomly at a whim like the walls of some horrifying labyrinth. You are incoherent and, I suspect, quite deliberately so.

Privilege, hahaha. You say that like we're not both posting on an uncensored Internet site in a common tongue like English about inessential fandom-related topics in our copious amounts of leisure time. That's a good one. You do have a sense of humour after all.

Peace out.

[(Anonymous)]

+1000000000

[(Anonymous)]

you might as well give up, anon.

chixb4dix is content in her ignorant reality.

[(Anonymous)]

Sad but true. It's amazing to meet someone who's wrong in so many directions at once. But also rewarding to read the thoughts of the well-spoken dissenters in the fracas :)

[(Anonymous)]

The level of math required to function as a member of society (adding, subtracting, percentages) is learned by most students by the time they are in middle school. Learning to perform these functions is analogous to learning to read, another important life skill. Beyond that, math is as practically useless (for everday needs) as literature, so yeah, they really aren't that different at the high school (i.e. "classic literature") level.

(I'm pretty sure you just got told.)

[cold-river-blue.livejournal.com]

I think literature has a tremendous impact on our lives (like any form of popular media). That said, do you honestly believe we should only be teaching children the basic skills they need for "everyday life?" I feel that schools should be doing much, much more than that.

[chixb4dix.livejournal.com]

It would be awesome if schools could teach kids everything that matters. They can't. Time and resources are limited.

So schools choose what books they make students read. If they are all classics, then there will be no room for non-classics. If reading classics puts kids off from reading then nobody wins.
If we only teach kids classics then we will ignore much of human experience.

If I had a child I would encourage them to read vastly and about experiences that aren't familiar to them. Whitewesternrichheterodudes-experience already is presented in pretty much all subjects - we learn about them in history, in music they are what we have to play, how about art history etc. It's important but it isn't the only important thing so it isn't right how much it dominates.

But hey, whatever. My arguments serve no purpose. If people care to know how less presented groups feel in this world, they can find out. Most don't care. Literature elite certainly doesn't.

[(Anonymous)]

Either you see the point of understanding the work and thought that underpins the West, or you don't -- and if you don't, I shudder to think how you propose changing the system if you willfully refuse to grasp the philosophy and mindsets that formed it. The Western Canon matters for people in the West because it is the building blocks of the society. Trying to advance in the system, trying to work with it, or change it, without knowing that foundational structure is as useless as trying to remodel a house without knowing how to read blueprints.

But what do I know? I'm not white, I grew up working class, and I'm not a man. Clearly, I have every interest in maintaining the structures of oppression as evidenced by the work of Goethe and Dante in order to further my own oppression and my status as a second-class citizen in the US. I'm just here, parroting what the Man taught me because that's the way I like it.

[chixb4dix.livejournal.com]

I'm sorry you value the experiences of your own kind less than some dead dudes.

personally, I believe that society should advance and fixating on past wont do it.

[(Anonymous)]

Society can't advance if it doesn't know what to advance from, or how it got to the present point in the first place. Only by reading, comprehending and deconstructing the past -- the foundations of our culture -- can we hope to build upon and refine that culture.

Just because you're unwilling or unable to do that doesn't make the effort pointless or irrelevant.

And throwing in pointless veiled insults about anon's values doesn't help :)

[(Anonymous)]

except history does have a way of repeating itself if it's not learned from.

or did you not learn that in school?

[(Anonymous)]

"My own kind?" I'm sorry, you make it sound like I'm a different species. I'm certain you didn't mean to imply anything of the kind.

I do read literature written by my ethnic group. "My own kind," as you so eloquently put it. And by women. And by plenty of other people -- many, many, many of whom were directly influenced or work in response to the Western Canon, and in response to Western civilization. Without the knowledge of the Western Canon, I would not know to what they were responding. I wouldn't grasp the references they made, the allusions they made, the very world in which their work was situated. I wouldn't understand the reception their works had, or why they stand alone. I would only understand them in one dimension, in one level of discourse, and I would not be able to look across any boundary in order to place them contextually on the landscape in which they emerged. That's why the Western Canon matters -- it makes up a large portion of the territory on which we all trod in the West.

So let me phrase it this way: I'm sorry that you think the only experiences that can speak to you are the ones that come from your socio-ethnic group, and that the dominant paradigm offers you nothing, not even the opportunities to break it once you understand it. I'm sorry that no-one taught you how to use the master's tools to break down his structures. However, my education has been far more comprehensive, and I shall seize my opportunities where and when I may.

[cold-river-blue.livejournal.com]

Eloquently put, anon! Brava!

[(Anonymous)]

Thank you, thank you, don't applaud, just tell your senators to fund the humanities.

[(Anonymous)]

Fan-fucking-tastic post. Thank you for having the eloquence and the patience. If this were a proper forum and not some archaic joke of a system, I'd emptyquote you.

[(Anonymous)]

A moment of disclosure: I'm a graduate student in the humanities. I spend many, many, many hours justifying why my field, why the Western Canon matters. I have thought about it a great deal, and it certainly is a topic near and dear to my heart. So my patience is a skill well-honed through repeated use. If I don't believe in the Western Canon, then I don't believe in the foundation of my life's work.

[(Anonymous)]

I think I love you.

By which I mean this is a brilliant post and I applaud you.

[(Anonymous)]

Always happy to come to the defense of the intellectual treasures of Western civ. It's rather what I do, even if only to take them apart later. Like I said above, don't applaud, just tell your senators to fund the humanities.

[armistice-day.livejournal.com]

Thank goodness for your presence in this thread and for your contribution to this "discussion". Here I was beginning to despair. ♥