fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #1644 ]

[ SECRET POST #1644 ]

⌈ Secret Post #1644 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.

__________________________________________________

02.

__________________________________________________

03.

__________________________________________________

04.

__________________________________________________

05.

__________________________________________________

06.

__________________________________________________

07.

__________________________________________________

08.

__________________________________________________

09.

__________________________________________________

10.

__________________________________________________

11.

__________________________________________________

12.

__________________________________________________

13.

__________________________________________________

14.

__________________________________________________

15.

__________________________________________________

16.

__________________________________________________

17.

__________________________________________________

18.

__________________________________________________

19.

__________________________________________________

20.

__________________________________________________

21.

__________________________________________________

22.

__________________________________________________

23.

__________________________________________________

24.

__________________________________________________

25.

__________________________________________________

26.

__________________________________________________

27.

__________________________________________________

28.

__________________________________________________

29.

__________________________________________________

30.

__________________________________________________

31.

__________________________________________________

32.

__________________________________________________

33.

__________________________________________________

34.

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 07 pages, 159 secrets from Secret Submission Post #235.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - hit/ship/spiration ], [ 0 - omgiknowthem ], [ 1 - troll/wank elsewhere ], [ 1 - repeats ]
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

It actually horribly scared me at the time I saw it as a kid - I sorta picked up on the rapey-ness of it without understanding it - and it continues to escape me how everyone else missed the RAEP, or why any adult likes this highly inappropriate "kids" movie.

(I recognise it's a good song, but the lyrics make me rage too much to enjoy it. He's going to burn down all of Paris so he can rape her? Oh, what a wonderful man. I wish he was real so I could stab him.

Also, I don't understand why making him a judge rather than a priest truly improves anything at all. Huh? Like a judge doesn't have a tremendous amount of power? And when I was a kid, I dunno, maybe it's because my family is secular, but I don't think it would have made a difference to me.)

But I swear, I seem to be the only one who was truly repulsed and bad-scare frightened by this movie as a kid. Everyone else seems to have fond memories. So you're not alone? Most people seem to think this movie was great, despite and even because of the dark implications of that scene. I guess it just didn't bother other people the same way.

And all the above being said... It's an awesome book. FOR ADULTS. :P But awesome. Someone in here recommended it to me when I said I didn't like the movie, and now I'm passing that rec on.

I kind of love it when people don't skimp on the nastiness of certain characters/situations just because certain media is meant for kids. When they do it just feels like their talking down to kids.

Did that make sense? xD

I get that, but would you seriously argue that it's appropriate to expose children to everything? Extreme violence and rape apologia tend to be things on my list of "stuff kids shouldn't be exposed to."

Particularly for kids who've been sexually abused, I think seeing Frollo blame Esmeralda for his lust would be confusing and upsetting. (I suspect this may be the reason I picked up on it when other kids didn't, but I'm not sure.) It's something that I really think you need to be closer to adulthood to understand.

Of course not. Some things are not appropriate for kids and that's that. I would never think it's a good thing to say, let your 5 year old sit through a Saw marathon, or play Grand Theft Auto, but I don't believe showing a character like Frollo is to extreme personally.

I understand where you're coming from though! I don't want to disregard the feelings of one who has had such a negative experience and it's not surprising that a character like Frollo that illicits a repulsed response from someone who hasn't been sexually abused would have an even stronger impact on someone who has.

Frollo wasn't shown as a good person at all for his behavior though so even if the subject matter is rather steep for a kids movie they still pick up on the basic message that rape apologism (didiusethisright?) is a very bad thing.

As a kid I did not pick up on his behavior in a sexual context, but it was still very disturbing because he was blaming her for his feelings and generally being creepy... I guess what I'm trying to say is that it sends an anti-rape apologist message but I can definitely see where it could be harmful. Thank you for showing me a different perspective, I hope I'm not coming off as mean or anything D:

You're not the only one. I was uncomfortable with some aspects of it when it first came out, though I was an early teen at the time. Back then, I couldn't believe Disney made Hunchback into a movie, despite how much they Disney-fied it.

It was way too dark for it's 'G' rating. I don't know of another Disney movie that discusses infanticide, hanging, or lust (to the extent that it was shown). One of my friends growing up was horrified her little sister went to see that movie. Parents see the Disney label and a 'G' rating and assume it's family friendly, and this was one time when an animated movie should have gotten the 'PG' rating.

But the music was great and visually it was stunning I think it was one of last movies Disney animated in that style before switching to the more angular animations. The story they told was done well... it just was a bit mature for young children.

Yeah, pretty much all of this, especially "what was Disney thinking"?

I mean, how did that producers meeting go? Seriously.

Weeeell, you're not really supposed to think he's wonderful, are you? He's blatantly a huge asshole. He killed some chick because she was a gypsy, and then he was gonna kill her baby. He's supposed to make you extremely uncomfortable. He's also hardly the first bad-guy to go after the scandalously-young heroine in a creepy way. It's kind of a common trope, even in a kids' media. Having him being a powerful real-world figure does complicate things a bit, though; I understand that being uncomfortable. Which brings me to my next point!

I suspect the reason that he's a judge and not a priest has little to do with making him less scary, and lots to do with Disney not wanting to be blacklisted by the Catholic Church. (I say this as someone who was raised Catholic) That kind of seriously negative image associated with the Church would have gone over like a lead balloon.

I agree that this probably could have used a PG rating, but I don't think it was "highly inappropriate" for kids. Kids aren't stupid. Real conflicts and even a bit of danger are as important to a good kids' movie as they are to a film meant for adults. The important part is how it is presented.

Sorry for the mini-speech there >

Weeeell, you're not really supposed to think he's wonderful, are you?

*flails* I...don't really know how to respond to this? I don't just think he's "not wonderful," I don't just dislike the character - he viscerally, physically disgusts me. I get that he's not "supposed" to be likable, but...that's not the point, to me.

I suspect the reason that he's a judge and not a priest has little to do with making him less scary, and lots to do with Disney not wanting to be blacklisted by the Catholic Church. (I say this as someone who was raised Catholic) That kind of seriously negative image associated with the Church would have gone over like a lead balloon.

Oooh, very good point, thanks. As stated, I come from a family of atheists, so I tend to be very stupid about stuff related to religion (including the politics), so this never would have occurred to me.

I don't think it was "highly inappropriate" for kids. Kids aren't stupid. Real conflicts and even a bit of danger are as important to a good kids' movie as they are to a film meant for adults.

This might be lazy, but to repeat what I said in a comment above:

I get that, but would you seriously argue that it's appropriate to expose children to everything? Extreme violence and rape apologia tend to be things on my list of "stuff kids shouldn't be exposed to."

(I should probably add that I don't think the first thing was included in Hunchback, I only added in "extreme violence" as another example of stuff people generally agree kids shouldn't see.)

I don't think there's ANY way I would want to "present" rape apologia to children, and that's basically what I think this song is.

Sorry for the mini-speech there

It's cool! I've tried to avoid ranting about this movie on Hunchback-related secrets for a while now, since my unending squick with this movie is never related to the secret, and I'm trying really hard now not to be that THAT'S NICE BUT I DIDN'T LIKE IT guy, but since this secret actually was, pretty much, directly about the thing that squicks me... :P

And every time I discuss this movie with someone, I think I hammer out just a little better what bugs me about it. So. Yeah.

*flails* I...don't really know how to respond to this? I don't just think he's "not wonderful," I don't just dislike the character - he viscerally, physically disgusts me. I get that he's not "supposed" to be likable, but...that's not the point, to me.

I... don't get it. He's a villain. Him being disgusting and scary is the whole point. Are you saying that fiction (or children's fiction?) should never contain villains that are truly despicable? :/

I don't just dislike the character - he viscerally, physically disgusts me.

Okay, I see where you're coming from on that. And I understand that this isn't really a topic for young kids.

I'm a little confused about how it's rape apologia though... I mean, yeah, he says it's not his fault, but I think the point is to highlight his hypocrisy, not that, actually, it's not his fault. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you though.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #1644 ]

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject