[ SECRET POST #1920 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1920 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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26. http://i42.tinypic.com/21m7v28.png
[linked for... sort of scribbly porny, not really]








Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 040 secrets from Secret Submission Post #274.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[chocorate.livejournal.com]

I'm still sad that so many people hate Catelyn. She's one of my faves also.

I can't imagine all of the Cersei hate..Never touching this fandom tbh

[margerydaw-s2.livejournal.com]

Won't lie, I'm not very fond of Cersei myself (as in, if she were a real person I'd HATE her), but she is one of the most awesome characters.

[sephystabbity.livejournal.com]

Never touching this fandom tbh

That's actually quite a wise decision, especially considering how the majority of the fandom is. I can totally understand why you would not want to get into a fandom with such a track record of failing, when it comes to the female characters.

I can't imagine all of the Cersei hate.

It seems to have intensified even more after the TV series, which is odd, because the TV series actually portrays her more sympathetically than the books do. There was this interview with Lena Headey (Cersei's actress) where she said she actually gets treated terribly by fans (like, legit terribly, not just "OMG, YOU PLAY SUCH A MEAN CHARACTER!") because of the character she plays. Which just boggles my mind, tbh.

[fauxkaren.livejournal.com]

Catelyn is such a brilliant character. I can understand people not ~loving her, but HATE? idgi.

[margerydaw-s2.livejournal.com]

They're jelly because she speaks truth and is smarter than they could ever hope to be, tbh.

[fauxkaren.livejournal.com]

True facts.

I'm kinda pressed that the show is de-emphasizing that part of her. :(

[sephystabbity.livejournal.com]

I'm kinda pressed that the show is de-emphasizing that part of her. :(

And all just to make Robb look better! I don't dislike Robb, but we don't really need yet another 'the boy who would king" story.

[fauxkaren.livejournal.com]

The point of Robb's story is that it's a deconstruction of the Boy King trope. He struggles with the real issues a Boy King would struggle with. He can't control his bannermen and he doesn't want to undermine his authority by being seen listening to his mother. He's not great at politics and diplomacy and he make some really stupid errors due to letting his emotions make decisions for him. That's the POINT of Robb. So making him this politician who comes up with the idea to treat with Renly is just... missing the point.

Blegh. Idk. I jumped into the shark tank and wrote a post about it over at westeros.org.

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/64184-book-spoilers-where-is-catelyn-stark-and-what-has-hbo-done-with-her/

[sephystabbity.livejournal.com]

it's a deconstruction of the Boy King trope.

Yes! It is amazing how many people do not get just how anti-war, anti-vengeance (and to a large extent, anti-monarchy) Asoiaf is, and just how many tropes it is completely trying to deconstruct. Like, I completely understand both what you said about the Boy King tropes and the Cat=mother trope, and I agree.

But, even the TV show writers do not seem to get it. Or, if they do, they are choosing to ignore it in favour of the tried and true path, in order to keep the TV show audience. Which just frustrates me, but I guess money (and viewership) speaks.

I legit dread what they're going to do to her character, come the pivotal events later on. If they are change her (crucial) parts in those events, I will be furious.

I read your points, (and the points of the user named Alexia as well). While I don't have any inclination to brave the pit that is Westeros.org and comment over there, I agree. I don't really have much coherent arguments to add, because you've laid it out well. All I have to say is, I want my smart and keen, flawed yet flawless, Catelyn back.

So disappointed with this episode, in that regard, I have to say.

[fauxkaren.livejournal.com]

The HBO writers REALLY don't get Catelyn, and it shows. Case in point the "we will kill them all" scene. See, the point of Lady Stoneheart is to contrast her with Catelyn. Catelyn might desire vengeance deep down, but she is rational and knows that vengeance and blood won't bring her husband back. Catelyn just wants her family safe. But in depth all that humanity is stripped from her and she becomes this monstrous creature intent on getting revenge and that is just NOT Catelyn. There needs to be that contrast, but by having Catelyn say "we will kill them all" on the TV show, that contrast is lost.

[sephystabbity.livejournal.com]

There needs to be that contrast, but by having Catelyn say "we will kill them all" on the TV show, that contrast is lost.

Yeah, it's like, an excuse for a "BAM! FUCK YEAH, THE NORTH!" scene, which just sorely misses out on so much. They are missing what is (to me), the very best part of Catelyn's PoVs, the parts about how she deals with Ned and her children's deaths. And in addition, they are going COMPLETELY contrary to the parts where she ruminates about how war had made her into an adult, the 'knights of summer' observation, and the "Cersei Lannister is laughing herself breathless" observation.

Just, yeah, the meaning behind Lady Stoneheart is being reduced piece by piece, in the show. And I am just like, where is the Catelyn, who did everything she could to keep her kids safe, and was the one who was against the war.

[margerydaw-s2.livejournal.com]

Me too, and I know I can never love her nearly as much as you do, so I always imagine you're doing something akin to pulling your hair and screaming in frustration at the tv.

[fauxkaren.livejournal.com]

LOLLLLL I JUST WRITE TL;DR POSTS TO TUMBLR AND/OR LJ WITH MY ~FEELINGS.

And actually this week, I got myself involved in a lot of Cat stanning on W-i-C.net and westeors.org.

It makes me feel better even if it accomplishes nothing else.

[margerydaw-s2.livejournal.com]

That's a good coping mechanism, I suppose.

Kinda like I drown all my fuck homophobia feels by filling all blank pages on my notebook with drawings of King peach and his Knight of Flowers.

[piratesswoop.livejournal.com]

that sounds frankly quite adorable :3

[margerydaw-s2.livejournal.com]

It works quite well =)

[helenadax.livejournal.com]

Cersei is an awful human being. Why should people love her more than they love Joffrey or Walden Frey?

[fauxkaren.livejournal.com]

Because unlike Joffrey and Walder Frey, she is fleshed out as a character and the reader is given reasons to understand WHY she is the way that she is. She's a woman who has this desire to rule, but has been blocked from that solely because she was not a man. She spent years in an oppressive, abusive and unhappy marriage. And then she has the prophecy hanging over her. She just has all these things that contribute to her paranoia and her actions and that makes her an interesting character in spite of the fact that she IS a terrible human being.

[helenadax.livejournal.com]

So? I'm not saying she's not interesting, I'm saying there's no reason to love her, after everything she's done. I can feel sorry for her, sometimes, but right now she's on my list with the Freys, the Boltons and Littlefinger.

[fauxkaren.livejournal.com]

Well people love her because she's an interesting character and she's a really good example of the way that the patriarchy is damaging to women and society as a whole. I mean, I don't personally love her, but I have some friends who are huge stans who won't deny her bad actions, but they still find her fascinating as a character.

[helenadax.livejournal.com]

Sorry, I didn't explain myself. Someone complained about the hate that Cersei got and I'm just saying that she has earned that hate. Being a woman has nothing to do with it, not in this case. Most people hates her for the same reason they hate Joffrey and other disgusting male characters.

[sephystabbity.livejournal.com]

Well, it's sort of like how people love Jaime, even though he's done some pretty terrible things, and whines a whole lot. I get the love for him (he seems an interesting character to some) but personally, I'm a bit meh about him. I don't dislike him or anything, but as a character, I find him uninteresting.

Meanwhile, Cersei is just as terrible as Jaime (I think they are equally cruel, when push comes to shove), but she's rather interesting to read about, from my point of view.

[philstar22.livejournal.com]

And yet, your icon i s of Jaime who is just as bad as she is. He's fleshed out and sympathetic too, but he's not any better of a person than his sister. So a bit of a double standard there.

[helenadax.livejournal.com]

You missed the following comment where I'm saying that I didn't explain myself clearly. My point is: you can love Cersei if you want, but don't act all that outraged if most people just hate her, since she's earned that hate fair and square. Yeah, I like Jaime, his pov and his scenes with Brienne made me forgive him for what he did to Bran. But I see enough reasons to understand why other people would hate him.

[chocorate.livejournal.com]

Oh no, god she's a straight out hateful character but I was thinking of more the misogynistic kind of bashing flying everywhere