[ SECRET POST #1946 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1946 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 092 secrets from Secret Submission Post #278.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 - hit/ship/spiration ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

Err...what? Deviating from a cliche isn't indicative that a writer didn't "plan their narrative structure well enough." And yes, "hero gets the girl" is about as cliche as it gets.

And unless Katara and Aang each got paired off with someone hilariously random at the end (like...a voice-over that says "And then Aang Avatar-married the Cabbage merchant, and Katara married Combustion Man THE END!"), it wouldn't have been bad writing to have them not get together in the finale, and to imply that it would have been is just...ridiculous!

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

Respectfully disagree. "Hero gets the girl" is a conventional narrative convention, and if the story is set up to show from the first that the two are indeed attracted, compatible, and aiming in that direction, deviating from it can be jarring.

[(Anonymous)]

Wow. Making a note to avoid any fic you may write, because that sounds boring as hell.

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

It's a feature of fiction structure, though. You might not be able to avoid it so easily! ^_^ I'm sorry you want to end it on that note; I was enjoying the discussion!

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt (but not the first anon, if that makes sense)

And just...no. Just no. "The hero gets the girl" is a total cliche. It isn't a necessary part to any story structure. Having the hero get with his telegraphed love interest doesn't make a story inherently better, or have it inherently flow better, or really add anything to its narrative structure.

I...sort of suspect you don't actually know anything about story structure if you think that the hero not getting the girl is bad writing. I mean, you might like that cliche, and might not appreciate someone deviating from it...but just because you like a cliche doesn't make it any less of a cliche.

In fact, I think that kind of view is pretty silly and immature. Going against "conventional narrative convention" isn't inherently poor writing. That very line of reasoning is just ridiculous.

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

No, I agree with the depth of the points to which you're taking them! Going against "conventional narrative convention" isn't inherently poor writing, as you say--as long as you build some structure and justification in your narrative. If the story structure establishes very early on that two characters are compatible together, look like they're meant to get together, and leaves the reader hoping for them to get together from that early moment, putting them together at the end is one way of fulfilling that expectation and structure. But if you don't want to go that way, yeah, it's perfectly all right not to as long as the narrative spends time showing why this isn't going to be that kind of story. If we see, as the story progresses, that the characters look less and less compatible, or that this story has a theme of not being deceived by first impressions, or things were not what they seemed in that first meeting, or expectations generally being turned topsy-turvy--those are all appropriate structures to fulfill reader expectations, and less well-used than "Hero gets the girl." And they're fun that way, too. There's also, of course, the useful method of defusing the initial meeting involving "the Hero" and "the girl" so that you don't get those expectations in the first place.

"Hero gets the girl" may be cliche but it got that way because it's a part of conventional story structure. I don't mind it being called a cliche because conventions and cliches are terms used interchangably by some without being disparaging.

[(Anonymous)]

First anon

and leaves the reader hoping for them to get together from that early moment

Er...not everyone wants the hero to get the girl every time. In fact a lot of people are sick of it. And I don't typically ship people when they've only had one or two episodes together.

Anyway, my question was, it kind of sounded like you thought Aang and Katara were supposed to be together JUST BECAUSE they were the first couple. Which...is kind of a weird reason. I mean you can ship for whatever the reason you want but to me it seems very arbitrary. And boring.

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

First meetings in narrative can establish expectations, though. If there's any romantic tension created in the meeting that's one kind of expectation that the reader/viewer's given. I agree that being "together," as in two characters just present together, isn't enough, you are right! But romantic tension can be established in a few words or looks and can broadcast the author's intention. When that happens to characters before they've established romantic tension with anyone else in the story (I'm going to assume that's what we both mean by the "first couple"; by all means correct me if you meant something else) then that can be a powerful expectation, and it's true, I do like to cling to that unless I actively dislike the pairing idea from the start. Especially if the moments of romantic tension continue to be developed; a sudden change after all of that gets established feels like something went askew with the intended storyline.

[(Anonymous)]

Those are all very good points, but I disagree with your overall assessment for two reasons. One, I didn't pick up any romantic tension between Katara and Aang in the first episode, and I know I'm far from the only one. They did pick some up as the season progressed, though imo it was not as much as Katara had with Zuko or even Jet (probably because of Aang's immaturity). And yeah, I definitely thought by "first couple" you meant Main Guy and Main Girl who became friends in first episode. But even if they were the first couple to be presented romantically (which I guess they are unless you count Katara and Jet, as well as a few pairings that had nothing to do with either of them) that doesn't automatically mean people will think they should end up together or even that the writers were trying to say that. It's pretty common for a character to end up with someone other than their first romantic interest (see lots of examples from Harry Potter, for instance).

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

This is the point where I pretty much nod and agree with just about everything you've said, because now you're narrowing it down specifically to ATLA and the example of Aang and Katara, and you say, "I didn't pick up any romantic tension between Katara and Aang in the first episode." If the reader/viewer doesn't see romantic tension then no argument about author intention or narrative expectations are going to satisfy, I agree. I did perceive romantic tension between Aang and Katara right away, but you're right, not every viewer will. And boy, have I been on that side at times--the "What? You think that was romantic tension?" side. Don't get me started, I'll be here all night. ^_^