[ SECRET POST #2082 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2082 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.


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02.


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03.
[Fate/Zero]


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04.


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[ ----- SPOILERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]












05. [SPOILERS for Journey Into Mystery/Everything Burns]



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06. [SPOILERS for Avengers]



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07. [SPOILERS for Sweeney Todd]



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08. [SPOILERS]



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[ ----- TRIGGERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]














09. [WARNING for depression/suicide]

[Wilby Wonderful (2004)]


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10. [WARNING for abuse]

[True Blood]


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11. [WARNING for rape]



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12. [WARNING for suicide/self-harm]

[Alex Gaskarth/All Time Low]


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13. [WARNING for abuse]



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14. [WARNING for abuse/bullying]



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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #297.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ],.
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

10. [WARNING for abuse]
http://i.imgur.com/mqlyL.png
[True Blood]

[atgdng]

I tend to agree, and yet... Pam and Tara (individually and together) were pretty much the only thing I liked this season. Crap.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't know this fandom, but yup, people have a tendency to think that when a woman does something dangerous, it's harmless waffle because lol she's a woman. Women are fundamentally ineffectual and passive, and if they ever do something, it's only a reaction to something another person did, dontcha know?

[visp]

I think that the dynamic between them significantly changed when she because Tara's maker, as opposed to... (I'm thinking they were enemies at that scene but it's been a while... something to do with Tara being in league with the witches that cursed Pam and Eric?) so I'm not of the opinion that the earlier hostility between them precludes a romantic relationship now that they're on the same side. I think that the fact that Pam's her maker and has so much power over her, plus Tara being a newborn vamp makes the relationship a bit skeevy, however.

[(Anonymous)]

I wouldn't be able to stomach Pam/Tara on any other show but I don't think True Blood has produced many 'romantic' relationships that haven't been abusive or supremely fucked up. And compared to a lot of the others, Pam/Tara is actually pretty healthy. Not to mention that relationship dynamics between vampires, in general, tend to be pretty fucked up. Neither of those things negate the abusive/fucked up aspects of the Pam/Tara dynamic but I do think it looks a little different when judged by the rules of True Blood (+ vampire/vampire) canon.

But they also happen to be two of the only characters on the show I still care about and I like how much more empowered Tara's been since becoming a vampire (something that only happened because Pam turned her) so I could be biased.

[(Anonymous)]

Not to mention that relationship dynamics between vampires, in general, tend to be pretty fucked up.

I kind of disagree a little bit here. I think the vamps' relationships with humans/werewolves are fucked up (Eric/Lafayette, Jessica/Jason, even Bill/Sam) but one of the reasons I found TB a refreshing change from, say, Whedon vampires, is that with Harris'/Ball's vampires, there are strong familial ties to the ones they sire, are sired by, and obviously the ones who share the same sire. One of the things that humanize Pam in my eyes is her relationship with Eric, and I'm less irritated with Eric when he's all about Pam and Godrick and his...er...sister.

So I think you make a great point that now that Pam has sired Tara, that it won't be fucked up. I mean, when she strung that beauty queen up and glamoured her into being dedicated to Tara, the things she was saying about Tara sounded like they were the truth as she saw it. So I think she already loves Tara and I have no doubt she'll look out for Tara's well being ahead of her own. I mean, she allowed herself to get taken by the Authority so they would leave Tara alone. That's not fucked up, imo.

[(Anonymous)]

Not the anon you replied to but I think TB has a lot of messed up vampire relationships. The whole 'as your maker, I command' thing may not be abusive by vampire rules but it IS taking away someone's ability to consent and forcing them to do whatever you want. And as Bill/Lorena proves, that can become incredibly abusive and fucked up. This doesn't mean the maker/progeny relationship HAS to be abusive but the huge power imbalance definitely makes those relationships a bit...odd if sex is brought into the mix. (And so far, the only maker/progeny relationship we've seen to not include sex has been Bill/Jessica, at least to my recollection.)

[(Anonymous)]

The whole 'as your maker, I command' thing may not be abusive by vampire rules but it IS taking away someone's ability to consent and forcing them to do whatever you want.

Well, like you said, vampires have different rules. None of the vampires on the show treated it like it was abuse or that their will was taken away. I've never seen it used in relation to sex (yet) except the fucked up thing between Tara and Franklin and that was protrayed as the abuse it was.

And as Bill/Lorena proves, that can become incredibly abusive and fucked up.

I agree. That was the most fucked up vampire ship on the show. But their abuse was based on Bill's hatred was of being made a vampire against his will by Lorena, not because of his vampirism. And it was in no way portrayed as sexy or desirable. Bill was toxic in his abuse and Lorena was adequately shown to be pathetic in her continued love for Bill despite the fact that he fucking twisted her head all the way around during sex. Eww. Still the most WTF moment in TRUE BLOOD for me, tbh.

This doesn't mean the maker/progeny relationship HAS to be abusive but the huge power imbalance definitely makes those relationships a bit...odd if sex is brought into the mix.

By our standards, yes. Very much. But not by the show's standards. Like I said in my original comment, Eric and Pam have a very loving relationship, regardless of whether sex is involved or not. Eric protects and cherishes Pam while allowing her to be who she is, and we know he and his sister have a very sibling type relationship, despite the occasional bumping nasties, down to affectionately arguing about who daddy loved more. Bill and Jessica (my favorite Maker/Progeny relationship) is probably the healthiest relationship either of them have ever had.

Anyway, I'll stop now.

[countess_k]

Pam is also a vampire so most of humanity's rules don't apply to her, especially now that Tara is also a vampire AND her child. I don't know about the post Twilight vampire lore and how much it has changed form the old days but back when Anne Rice provided the source material it was general knowledge that makers owned their children. The duty of protecting a young, impressionable vamp in a mostly untamed, predatory community required the Master to take drastic measures including lots and lots of violence. It was also implied that no matter what the treatment, a certain bond always formed between Master and Progeny that had a strong potential to become romantic.

[(Anonymous)]

Who the fuck takes this show seriously tho? It's True Blood ffs

[velvet_mace]

Which of Tara's relationships hasn't been a ball of fucked up? She's just got really shitty, shitty luck and a writer who likes to torture her.

[(Anonymous)]

Sam? That girlfriend she had in the beginning of S4? Eggs treated her ok even if he was messed up himself.

[velvet_mace]

Tara pretty much killed her relationship with both of them -- the girl by lying about who she was, Sam because she just wasn't that into him. I don't really think Tara's cult driven, brainwashed romance with Eggs can be classified as being even close to non-fucked up.

[(Anonymous)]

The girl still wanted to stay with Tara, Tara made her leave after Pam attacked them.

[lilacsigil]

This is the fandom that passionately shipped Tara/Franklin...you know, the vampire who terrorised, kidnapped and repeatedly raped her, so this is nothing. But I agree with the other nonnies that their relationship has drastically changed since Tara became a vampire.

[(Anonymous)]

HOLY SHIT I STOPPED WATCHING TB HALFWAY THROUGH SEASON THREE AND PAM/TARA IS A REAL CANON SHIP NOW?!!?!?

AKJFHSDKJFHKSJHGKJS FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

[(Anonymous)]

(same anon as before)

this pleases me

[(Anonymous)]

As other people pointed out, the incident you mentioned happened before Tara and Pam had any semblance of a relationship...in fact, they were enemies back then so...I don't really think you can count it toward their relationship now.

And as far as this fandom not shipping it if Pam were a man...Bill/Sookie, Eric/Sookie, Hoyt/Jessica, Jason/Jessica, Franklin/Tara, Eggs/Tara...in all of those relationships, the dude was abusive at some point and yet, fandom still shipped it. (Yes, with some of them, the abuse was mutual but that doesn't make it okay or discount the man's behavior.)

[(Anonymous)]

Your only example that's comparable to the stalking and terrorizing Pam did is Franklin/Tara.

[(Anonymous)]

Its a bit ridiculous to try and compare abusive behaviors by saying one is worse than another. Eggs beat the living hell out of Tara because of Maryanne's influence. Bill and Eric both fed off Sookie against her will, not to mention the amount of emotional abuse they've put her through over the years. Hoyt's been emotionally abusive toward Jessica and came very close to letting his new 'friends' kill her and Jason shot her in the head. All of those examples as well as what Franklin and Pam did to Tara are forms of abuse and its going to be down to personal opinions as to which is less terrible than the others.

[(Anonymous)]

and Jason shot her in the head.

I know it's a minor point and I'm splitting hairs but come on, he shot her in the head because she was biting him against his will. She's a thousand times stronger than he is, so I don't think he had a lot of choices right then.

[(Anonymous)]

Oh, I don't disagree at all. Jessica was more physically abusive, with more of the emotional abuse coming from Jason that now he's decided he hates vampires. I only left out Jessica biting him because it wasn't relevant to the original poster's claim that Pam/Tara would be less acceptable if Pam was a man (so I was only focusing on abuse from the men in those relationships)

[(Anonymous)]

None of them actually tried to kill the other partner.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't know...After all, there was that time Bill came close to draining Sookie TO DEATH and people still shipped them. And Bill/Eric and Eric/Lafayette seem to be pretty popular among the slash fans...

Also, most of those people mentioned in the above examples who haven't tried to kill one another HAVE attempted to kill their enemies at some point, which is what Tara was to Pam when Pam attacked her. So I don't think we can judge Pam's attempted murder of Tara back then as an example of the abuse in their relationship since they didn't HAVE a relationship at that point.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think Bill, who had been tortured to near death trying to save Sookie, was starving, acted uncontrollably, and was horrified afterwards, is the same as what Pam did.

But yeah, Eric/Lafayette is worse than Pam/Tara.