[ SECRET POST #257 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #257 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 074 secrets from Secret Submission Post #037.
Secrets Not Posted: 0 broken links, 0 not!secrets, 0 not!fandom, [ 1 2 ] repeats.
Next Secret Post: Tomorrow, Thursday, September 20th, 2007.
Current Secret Submission Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[el-hustino.livejournal.com]

It's a perfectly sound argument. Zelda put on a male's outfit and called herself Sheik. Sheik is not a separate person. Sheik is Zelda pretending to be male. Which means that Sheik is Zelda. Since Zelda is female, Sheik is female.

[iamadoughnut.livejournal.com]

Um, no, it isn't. I've seen other media with a similar situation; when the character was dressed as a male, he was a he.

There's a certain gray area this kind of behavior falls into, somewhere between "lol just kidding!" and transvestism and drag. So yes, intent does make a difference in which pronoun is used, and an argument can probably be made either way.

[dorknessrising.livejournal.com]

Transvestism =/= transgenderism. Plz to be learning the difference, kthx.

[iamadoughnut.livejournal.com]

LOL, what? For one, I almost certainly know a shitload more about this topic than you do, so plz to not be making assumptions, kthx.

And second, where did I say a word about transgenderism? Seriously, what the fuck?

[el-hustino.livejournal.com]

There's a massive gray area concerning gender-identity, yes, which transvestitism and drag would fall under. With so little of Zelda's personality shown in the game, it is plausible--in a work of fanfiction--to make her case one of transvestitism, or gender-confusion, or associative identity disorder, or anything else similar to any of those and that would be an entirely different situation, but with no evidence of such in the game there seems to be no reason to make an assumption concerning her reasons to dress as a man beyond anything but an efficient way to not be recognized for who she was and, due to that, there seems to be no reason to label Sheik as a he. Referring to Sheik as a he in writing is entirely different: just because she is referred to as a he does not mean that's what she is.

Also, looking at the situation as a question of sex rather than gender, which--assuming Zelda is not a transsexual--has far less gray area, Sheik is female.

[iamadoughnut.livejournal.com]

For one, there's not actually a need to pathologize this with "disorders."

just because she is referred to as a he does not mean that's what she is.

Except that, from where I'm sitting (as a complete outsider who doesn't honestly give a damn either way), Sheik reads like a different persona. A male one. Regardless of what's underneath, the "role" of Sheik would be male. If she slipped back into being Zelda, sure, she's a she. If someone was writing from her point of view as Zelda-playing-Sheik, then sure... use "she" if you like. If writing about just Sheik, well, why not use "he"?

In what situation would you really have to refer to sex rather than gender? If it's a question of superficially and socially being taken for male, where does sex come into play?

[el-hustino.livejournal.com]

The character of Sheik is female. Sheik is not a different persona in any sense, just the name taken by a character (Zelda) pretending to be male in an attempt to hide during a time where, if her identity were known, she would be imprisoned and, most likely, eventually killed. They aren't alternate personalities or anything of the like. Sheik is Zelda, just with different clothes that she wears due to being in a bad situation. No other reason.

Also, sex is the physiological characteristics of male and female, meaning the body parts in one's pants.

Gender is the vaguer concept of self-identity, social roles, and the like.