fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2482 ]

[ SECRET POST #2482 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2482 ⌋

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Notes:

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I had this idea about this steampunk story I started about the Victorian age but with the gender-rights situation flipped. A matriarchal but flawed society. When I posted it on Fiction press it got a few people interested. I kinda thought about moving it to A03 and continuing (A03 is more familiar to me) .

The only thing stopping me is the possible reactions. That people will yell at me and cuss me out because they think I'm an MRA. Is that likely? Could I get away with telling this simple story without people thinking I have an ulterior motive?

I worded this poorly.

Sorry if I sound passive aggressive.

yeah wow...this really sounds trollish and shitty. Why did I even post this?

Well, any work has the potential to upset people really, but I see what you mean. You might be right about people questioning your motives, because one of the main MRA tenets is "OMG what about teh poor menz??" so it's a hot button issue. I sympathize with that getting in the way of the story you want to tell, and ordinarily I'd say go for it regardless. But I do think it's worth reassessing just how hard you want to tread on mine-filled ground. Not that long ago, there was some controversy over an author who decided to write a story where racial minorities were flipped. I'm pretty sure she thought it wasn't racist when she published it and that she was just writing a story with no ulterior motive, but... well, take a look:

http://www.theguardian.com/books/2012/aug/21/racism-row-novel-coals-pearls

I'm not saying you'd be doing the same, only that sometimes the intentions of a writer can go awry with the execution of their ideas and that merely flipping around a controversial issue to tell a story isn't always enough to pull off those ideas well. Here's another viewpoint about "reverse discrimination" stories being a very tired idea:

http://spacehawk.livejournal.com/861602.html

This quote stands out:

These stories are a dime a dozen. I've seen it with LGBT issues, with racial issues, with gender issues, and with other axes of identity. The concept is not new, not creative, not original, not fresh, and not clever. For any axis of real-world privilege, there are sci fi authors (and would-be authors) who think they are so clever for making themselves (as real-world privileged people) the "new oppressed people, oh woe is us!"

#privilegefantasy, #seenthismoviebefore

Again, this is not to say that you shouldn't write this story simply because people will yell and/or consider it a dull cliche. But it's food for thought. Personally, I'm kind of curious as to what you want to accomplish with a story like this, but I have to be frank-- the writing would have to knock my freaking socks off to convince me to read it, more because of the cliche factor than the MRA factor.

To be fair, while it's true they aren't exactly a fresh idea they can, and are, effectively used to get people thinking about what the other side faces in the real world. So...if done *well*, they can be pretty powerful and thought provoking. Sadly, when done badly...well. You read the article, and it's a lot easier to go the lazy route than making sure the writing conveys it in a way that doesn't come off bigoted.

I read the first article and wow yeah I can really see how that came out wrong. I mean it's obvious, reading that article on the race-related book how it came out wrong- because it took the road of making white people the "more special and unique while insulting the other side". It was done insensitively.

I'd like to think that if I were to write this (probably not) I'd make sure to keep in mind that both "sides" are still equally human and I wouldn't raise one up while condemning the other. Also I am a woman myself and one who believes in feminism.

I originally took up the idea when I was younger out of curiosity. But now looking back I don't know if it's such a great idea. Probably not now that I think about it.

Personally if I were going to write any kind of story about prejudice I'd probably do it a less offensive way by writing about fictional groups, because it feels easier to do that in away that doesn't risk slapping an existing group of people in the face,

What you're saying is true, but....swapping the roles can also be a way to get people to see the other side's point of view if done well.

For example the short movie on YT "Love is all you need" managed to get several comments of "Oh I get it now" from people who previously didn't get some things about LGBT rights/activism. The movie swapped the roles and then ended it with "this was based on the accounts of real bullying that LBGT teens went through." Basically "Hey you know the sad story in this movie, yeah this happens EVERY DAY to real kids.THAT'S why this is important"

It wasn't done as a way to stroke the egos of the people who were portrayed as victims in the story, it was done as a way to give them a wake up call. Unfortunate as it is some people won't get it until they are able to imagine it happening to them It may seem selfish or stupid but it at least fulfilled the goal of getting their attention and getting them to understand.

I agree that when done poorly this 'plot idea' can really deeply offend and hurt people, but there's a lot of other premises that can do that as well. Things like Stereotypes and the like. But I don't think that means the whole idea should be written off as "only ever a bad, self centered persecution fantasy and nothing more".

I think it would depend in what way the matriarchy is flawed? I mean, to me, the concept of a matriarchy is interesting, and I've read fiction that has had it be flawed in some way, but I think it really depends on how it reads. If it's just a complete gender flip with women essentially doing the exact same things that men do in a patriarchy, I would find that not so plausible, and I'd probably wonder about MRA, too. If it were more nuanced than that, though, I would be interested. Does that make sense?

I see I'd probably try to make it well....flawed in a different way that makes more sense. Because just having women do what men do is rather lazy you know.

I'd try to find things women would that might fit better. Ways they could discriminate that are different. Any thoughts or suggestions you might have?

Argh, hm. I'm not sure I can come up with stuff right off like that. I'm assuming you are the OP? If so, I actually do find your idea very interesting and would be willing to read it and offer my thoughts, if you like! You can either PM me here on DW or e-mail me at mistressnonny@gmail.com, but if you're not comfortable with that, that's cool too. :)

Yeah.

and thanks...though I'm unsure if I'm going to go forward with the idea. I think I'll just email to talk about it. I did have one character written and one partially written. They're from a while ago so i don't know how good they are.

It might be interesting to just see it be basically like Patriarchy, just with the values switched. Like, you have a lot of the same stereotypes for 'women-like' things and 'men-like' things, it's just that women-like is seen as better than male-like.

Not an exact flip, of course, because in a matriarchal version, women would clearly be seen as more suited to rule and stuff, but it would because men are seen as violent savages that aren't properly able to contain their animal impulses or something.

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[ SECRET POST #2482 ]

Nervous about uploading and continuing speculative fiction story

SA

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AYRT

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