[ SECRET POST #2638 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2638 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 055 secrets from Secret Submission Post #377.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

Massive post about sexism incoming

[feotakahari]

You're talking as if sexism is passive--"you exist within this group." Sexism is a monitoring process--"you belong within this group, and you will be punished, in one way or another, if you step out of it." Assuming a simple model of a group that's defined as "lesser" and a group that's defined as "greater," those who are in the "lesser" group are punished if they try to stand out, while those who are in the "greater" group are punished if they fail to fulfill the group's standards of greatness.

In other words, men don't discriminate against men for being men, but they do construct a definition of "not-men," male-gendered people who are framed as womanly and can therefore be mocked or humiliate without consequence. (In America, a common term for these men is "fag," applied not just to gay people, but to a variety of men who for whatever reason aren't seen as manly.)

Of course, this is massively oversimplifying, but it's misguided to say that sexism is against women. I don't think it's possible for there to exist bigotry against a group without there also being bigotry against the group defined as opposing it, at least in the sense that the group self-polices and punishes the "weak."

Edit: I just realized I went on a spiel about men's sexism against men in a thread about women's sexism against men. I apologize for going so far off-topic.

Re: Massive post about sexism incoming

[(Anonymous)]

men who are mocked for not being manly - in other words, having qualities that have been designated more "womanly" by societal standards - are suffering consequences that result from misogyny, not sexism against men.

Re: Massive post about sexism incoming

[(Anonymous)]

Christ... they're men, they are experiencing sexism, it is directed at them, for being men. Why do you have to torture the definitions until you somehow win this? Why is this a thing you want to win?

Re: Massive post about sexism incoming

[(Anonymous)]

nayrt. Because it's the Oppression Olympics! Instead of running every four years, it runs every four minutes.

Re: Massive post about sexism incoming

[(Anonymous)]

because the fact that it has to do with misogyny is the point and it's that we should be working to tear down?

i don't see why that's too hard to understand. i mean this shit is even tied into how men view homosexuality. it's linked to how our society views women and how that affects everything else.

Re: Massive post about sexism incoming

[(Anonymous)]

Because acting like it's NOT a result of misogyny will actually undermine attempts to stop it? Like, if you don't correctly identify the source, you can't stop the problem.

Re: Massive post about sexism incoming

[(Anonymous)]

But that's just the thing -- it's not directed at them for being men. It's directed at them for acting too much like women. When the very worst thing that Group A can do is act in ways or be interested in things that are associated with Group B, then that points to there being a strong, negative valuation of Group B. And if it's likewise considered acceptable for Group B to act in ways or be interested in things that are associated with Group A, well...then that connection is only further strengthened.

Men can't act like women. Women can act like men. This points to be "men" being the greater group and "women" being the lesser.

It's not about winning. It's about teasing apart why something is the way it is, and then using that knowledge to fix it. You can't cure a disease by just focusing on the symptoms. If we were to "cure" misogyny and institutionalized sexism against women, then the "symptoms" experienced by men would fade away.

Re: Massive post about sexism incoming

[diet_poison]

this.