fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2705 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2705 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.

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02.

[Nostalgia Critic, Sailor Moon]

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03.

[Sailor Moon]

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04.

[Jessica Chastain]

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05.

[Homestuck]

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06.

[The Musketeers]

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07.

[Absolutely Fabulous]

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08.

[Disney's Big Hero 6]

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09.

[Neil Gaiman and Amanda Palmer]

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10.

[Revolution]

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11.

[Disney Fairies; character is Vidia]

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12. http://oi57.tinypic.com/28jg5l.jpg
[kind of pornish, illustrated]

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13.

14. [SPOILERS for Game of Thrones]

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15. [SPOILERS for Transistor]

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16. [SPOILERS for Hannibal]

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17. [SPOILERS for Star-Crossed]

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18. [SPOILERS for Captain America: The Winter Soldier]

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19. [SPOILERS for Hannibal]
[WARNING for rape]

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20. [WARNING for rape]

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21. [WARNING for abuse]

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22. [WARNING for rape/non-con]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #386.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Um, no. Serenity is not "a love letter to the confederacy." Is civil war a prominent feature? Oh my, yes. Is the US Civil War the only civil war and all other wars are just imitations of it? No. I say this as a happy American: Loosen the patriot goggles a little bit.

And "good" is not necessarily the same thing as "profitable." Plus, I'd argue Angel and Firefly were better than Buffy. Dollhouse was kind of shit, though, I thought.

It's true that there's many other civil wars. But, you know, the setup of the world in Firefly does match the romanticized image of how Confederate apologists saw the Confederacy. More importantly, it's explicitly a space Western, with many features that align very closely with the classical American Western genre. And the classical American Western is set in the period immediately after the Civil War, and the archetypal Western hero is a Civil War veteran usually on the side of the Confederacy. I mean, you know, it'd be one thing if it was just a generic civil war space series. But Whedon is intentionally referencing a genre of film that's specifically American, and carrying over a ton of the iconography. And when you have that as your starting point, and then you have something that looks a lot like the American Civil War and that plays the same role in the series, it's really not a stretch to identify them. I mean this is an American TV series that's referencing a longstanding American cultural idea here, you don't have to have 'patriot goggles' to think maybe it could be related to American history and culture.

Mind you, I don't think it's a 'love letter to the Confederacy', but it is at the very least uncritically replicating the structure and tropes of a genre that's full of stuff like that. The series has a hero defending the space-Confederacy in the same way and the same terms that Confederate apologists, including the ones in the source genre, used to defend the real Confederacy, and that has to be on Whedon to some extent.

And I know some people have suggested that at some point that Whedon would have complicated that picture if time had gone on (like he kinda did with the Reavers which is why the fact that they're straight-up Space Indians is a little less bad) but we can only really judge what we see in the series I think.

It always seemed a little more like a historical AU cast as a space western to me. The Browncoats read very much like they were supposed to be an underdog Union that lost the war to the Confederate-analog Alliance, between the slavery on the Alliance-positive Core worlds (Shindig) and the Rim worlds that wanted to ape the Core (Hero of Canton), the 'genteel south' aesthetic of at least two of the Core worlds (Shindig and Trash), and the fact that the character explicitly named after a Confederate figure was Alliance-employed. Which definitely poses its own problems, but is already a little more nuanced than "Confederate apologism in space".

Yeah once you use as your starting point an Era so soaked in racism (not just against blacks, but the racism against Chinese was also coming to the fore then) and sexism, then you are setting yourself up for problems. You really have to take a great deal of care to zig where ever reality zagged, and Whedon just accepted the premise and wrote to the archetypes without examining them in the slightest. That means it just took all the problems of the era and transplanted them into space, which made them look a whole lot worse. Frankly it should never have been commissioned to start with, and it is probably a blessing it was cancelled so quickly before the whole horror of the racism and sexism could be shown.

Glad all you fucking SJWs could come out and play. Kindly go play in traffic and die please.

A response mean "I have no way to counteract your argument, so I'll just be abusive instead". Thank you nonny for conceding the point in such a very classy way.

Yes, because Firefly is sooo racist and sexist.

Oh wait.

No it isn't.

Holy shit, dude. Reavers as "space Indians" is a fucking stupid thing to say. Reavers are not indigenous people; they are settlers who have gone mad. They were not there to begin with.

Yeah, you're right. That's pretty much what I was referring to when I said that Whedon complicated the situation with the Reavers as opposed to the Browncoats, and why they're not space Indians. That is absolutely the role they play in the setting, in the same way that the Browncoats play the role of the Confederacy, but Whedon threw a curveball wrt the Reavers and not the Browncoats.

Mea culpa on that one, sorry.

[ SECRET POST #2705 ]

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