[ SECRET POST #2726 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2726 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.


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02.
[Naruto]


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03.
[Transformers: Prime]


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04.


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05. http://i.imgur.com/dkPX9Ym.gif
[moving .gif, Steven Ogg, Grand Theft Auto V]


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06.


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07. [SPOILERS for Murder in the First]



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08. [SPOILERS for Game of Thrones]



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09. [WARNING for rape]



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10. [WARNING for rape]



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11. [WARNING for rape, abuse, etc]



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12. [WARNING for rape, abuse, pedophilia, incest, ironically enough none of which OP warned for]



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13. [WARNING for eating disorders]



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14. [WARNING for suicide]



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15. [WARNING for sexual abuse]



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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #389.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 - ships it ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

I didn't say any of what you said in the first paragraph, I don't know where you're coming from.

If you're completely drunk, then maybe you do want the sex, maybe you don't. An outsider can't tell. And that's the point. You're not assumed to not have wanted it, they are assumed to not have been able to tell for sure. They couldn't know for sure whether you really wanted it and took the chance and did it anyway. What if you hadn't really wanted it? I mean, if you did want it, great! Everything worked out for you. But if you didn't...

Well, that makes the second person pretty careless and possibly abusive, if they ignore that risk and do whatever they want with you.

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt

It seemed like you were making a distinction between someone who is violent while drunk and someone who has sex while drunk. If you weren't, then I mistook you, and I apologize.

I can understand this idea that sometimes, another party might not know the difference. That's why I think that if someone is confused or disoriented, then there's a line to be drawn. But the thing that bothers me is that the ability to choose to assumed in someone who makes any number of careless decisions while drunk, but is not assumed in someone who has sex. Either you can't make decisions while drunk, or you can.

I said it downthread, but I'll say it again here: another reason why I'm bothered is because I don't like the idea that the mere fact of me drinking means that I am no longer capable of knowing my own mind and my own desires. I also don't like the idea that my partner is careless and abusive, when I am making a conscious choice.

[(Anonymous)]

I said it below, and I'll say it again:

It's about being responsible for the impact of your actions on others, not simply for your actions.

If someone is sober enough to consent to having sex with you, you don't hurt that person if they have sex with you.

If they don't consent, then you can absolutely sexually assault someone while drunk and be held responsible.

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt

I agree with you. My problem is with the idea that, if you've been drinking, then you can't consent.

[(Anonymous)]

Then you should have said that instead of comparing it to being a violent drunk because someone who is a violent drunk victimizes others. It's not at all comparable, not considered comparable, and not something you can use to argue your point.

As for your statement there, it's too broad to agree or disagree with. Drinking what, and how much? What state of intoxication are you in?

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt

The trouble is that I think the two cases are linked by agency: the violent drunk is considered to have agency; the drunk who has sex is considered not to have agency. There's a disconnect there that bothers me in a way that it seems I'm unable to describe.

But, drinking what and how much -- well, that depends on the person. I myself can usually have about four drinks of hard liquor before I've hit my limit. The state of intoxication where I see this disconnect does not involve confusion, disorientation, or unconsciousness.

[(Anonymous)]

You take the consequences of the actions you performed. Having sex with a willing partner does not make that partner a victim of anything, while punching someone in the face, does make that person a victim of assault.

Where does agency come in?