fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2772 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2772 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.

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02.

[Audrey Tatou, Coco Avant Chanel]

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03.

[Orange is the New Black]

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04.

[Recettear]

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05.

[Mad Men]

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06.

[Game of Thrones]

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07.

[Archer]

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08.

[Kate Beaton's Hark! A Vagrant]

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09.

[Sleepy Hollow]

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10.

[Divergent]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 033 secrets from Secret Submission Post #396.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

No.

Feminism is about equality solely and above all else.

I choose my choice is the cancer killing feminism, well it and an obsession with intersectionality which leads to such a fractured reality as to make the movement useless.

If you want to imagine choice being the defining feature of feminism, imagine Charlotte from sex in the city stamping her feet like a toddler having a temper tantrum because her friends told her to stop being a womanchild, forever.

Sorry, but I disagree. Especially about your complaint about intersectionality. Intersectionality is super important. There are all sorts of women and many different forms of oppression, and their unique concerns should absolutely be part of the conversation and the fight.

As long as a woman's choice doesn't interfere with other woman's she should be free to choose. I can criticize the societal pressures for a woman to become a housewife while at the same time think that it is a perfectly valid choice that is right for many women. As long as they aren't telling me I should be a housewife too, they should be free to live their lives as the choose. It isn't what I want, but that doesn't make it a wrong choice to make.

The personal is political. We've so accepted the idea that everyone can do what they want as long as they're not directly voting against abortion or whatever that we've forgotten about secondary promotion of the patriarchy. The fact that so many women do choose to be stay at home mothers promotes a culture which hurts you whether they mean to or not, and honestly hurts them as well.

But what you are saying there is that it is wrong to be a housewife. And it is not. It is just as okay to be a housewife (or househusband) as it is to work outside the home. What is wrong is pressuring women to be one and judging them for not being one. What is equally wrong is putting less value on being a housewife or saying it is wrong.

It is wrong.

It's a privileged creation of an industrial capatalist society that is not sustainable and leads to women being second class.

Because as much as people may cry and nash their teeth - it's not a real job and belittles any women who spends large chunks of the best years of their life doing it.

Sorry, never going to agree with you on that. Yes, it is a fairly recent phenomena historically and many women (and men) would like to do it and can't. Doesn't make it wrong for a woman who can do it to choose to. It isn't a "job" in the sense of something you do outside the home and get paid for, but it is a vocation.

Lol, you want to talk about privileged creations of an industrial capitalist society and then you want to play like the only role in life that has any dignity is as a jobholder working for a salary in a capitalist economy

It's too hilarious.

This is irrelevant. The only way to combat this trend is to become the other side of the coin in a currency you despise. And there will always be people to "selfish" to care even then.

The only way to combat this trend is to become the other side of the coin in a currency you despise

I think we agree on the actual topic but if your argument is that the only way to "combat this trend" is to somehow become "the other side of the coin" merely by CRITICIZING SOMETHING ON THE INTERNET, that's bullshit.

Anon is allowed to criticize things! They aren't somehow harming women by doing so!

Edited 2014-08-06 00:28 (UTC)

You obviously have never had or cared for children.

u sound white

It's the realest of all jobs on a basic, biological level. Human children tend to get eaten by predators and hit by cars when left on their own. So unless we're aiming for the end of the human race as a SPECIES, then it makes sense to dedicate one parent to monitor the child as close as possible for as long as possible.

True, but before the nuclear family became such a huge thing, usually the parent dedicated to the kids would be grandparents, great aunts and uncles, and so on, because able-bodied younger adults couldn't be spared just to watch the kids without doing any other resource-generating work at all. The ideal of one parent works, other parent watches kids was never very sustainable for most people.

This is a good point.

but - to me, at least - the idea that the only legitimate response is to demand that both parents work, and that in fact this is the only morally acceptable thing to do for society as a whole, is pretty much the most perverse way possible to respond to that change

and second, even in the situation you're describing, the idea that there's a stark division between work inside the home and work outside of it, in terms of necessity for life, existed less than it does now, because there's a significant part of the family unit that's devoted to housework. and it gets even more tenuous of a distinction when you're talking about agricultural societies where it's all melded together. many of the things that you would describe as resource-generating work, or at least necessary work, are things that would be considered housework, in the modern era, and therefore not work at all.

Fuck this noise. >:(

Do you have any idea how expensive childcare is?

Staying at home is often a valid FINANCIAL choice.

Are you trolling us with that nonsense?

Not every woman can or should be a mother, let alone a "full-time" mother--nor should we expect every woman to want to do so. But rearing and educating a child is one of the noblest and most important things anyone, man or woman, can do--at least when done well, and it deserves to be done well, and not disparaged.

Most of the people who argue against choice feminism tend to have weird, bullshitty ideas about how women must act. They're trying to force individuals into a specific mold.

I don't think choosing to be a stay-at-home mother is an anti-feminist choice, for example, as long as I'm an equal partner. I don't think sex work or porn are necessarily anti-feminist. Everything is down to how people interact with each other.

As for the obsession with intersectionality, you have to makes sure it's the obsession you're critiquing, and not the mere idea. But yeah, the obsession is fucked up. Sometimes I wonder why these groups bother getting together if they're going to be talking about anything BUT feminism. Feminism isn't all things, and that's okay! Why can't you be a feminist AND anti-____? Why can't you fall into two categories? Why does every cause have to fall under that one umbrella?

+1 to pretty much all of this.

[ SECRET POST #2772 ]

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I agree wholeheartedly with this, EXCEPT:

Re: I agree wholeheartedly with this, EXCEPT: