fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2776 ]

[ SECRET POST #2776 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2776 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 085 secrets from Secret Submission Post #397.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Chris Pine is so badly miscast Kirk.

I don't think it's Pine. I think it's the writing. His Kirk is written as a douchey frat boy. Pine's a good actor but...goddamn are the writers horrid.

Agreed. The character they've written isn't Kirk as he existed on the TV show - it's a caricature of him, with the worst parts exaggerated to the point that they make up his main personality.

Honestly, I saw the 2009 film first and I was freaking shocked when I checked out TOS at how little Kirk resembled the pop culture depiction of him.

Yeah he broke rules, but after due consideration and always while trying to do the right thing, not because he thought he was above them.

Yeah he kissed lots of pretty ladies, but often times there was a secondary reason involved -- mind manipulation, he needed something to save the crew/Enterprise, because he genuinely fell for them, etc. And he never would have disrespected them the way Kirk does to Uhura and Marcus in the new films.

I can't stand the way they've mischaracterized him.

Nothing to add, but this is a good comment, and I'm glad you checked out the 'real' Kirk in TOS. :)

Yeah, pop culture Kirk is pretty much an invention of later parodists. Jim Kirk was married to his ship, but a real romantic when it came to women, rather than a lothario as such.

He was really good in the parts of ST09 where he actually got to play Captain Kirk

I agree that Pine isn't perfect and I'm not saying it's necessarily Quinto's fault, but does his Spock rub anyone else the wrong way? He's just always so…angry and condescending. It really rubs me the wrong way because it's almost the antithesis of Nimoy's Spock who was, if anything, much more detached and more of a woobie.

Agreed, totally. and what makes it worse is that then they try to play it like the friendship between Kirk and Spock is as epic and awesome as in TOS, but...when did that happen? Spock was such a dick to Kirk that like, why would he want to be friends with that? Especially since they pretty much do it just because old Spock told them to.

Like, really? Some old dude tells you to be friends because he and his Kirk were bffs, and even though they were nothing at all like you, you're just going to say ok, yep, obviously we're meant to be besties? Just, no.

I have lots of angry feelings about Quinto's Spock and how he relates to Pine's Kirk, none of which were made better by Into Darkness.

For me it's not just Kirk -- it's also Uhura.

Like, I don't understand why people aren't more angry about the fact that he knew it was her "unqualified desire" to serve on the Enterprise and he put her on the Farragut…

Or how in Into Darkness, when she's upset with him, he tells her that he "chooses not to feel" (effectively shutting her need for emotional reciprocation down) but then at the end of the film, that's proven to have been a lie because he can't "choose not to feel" when Kirk is dying. And instead he ends up crying and screaming.

The films just never seem to acknowledge that he's treating everyone around him horribly and it's NOT justified by the fact that he's a Vulcan and he lost his planet and mother.

It was nice to see him care about Kirk at the end but they're trying to sell him as emotionally constipated throughout both films while having a girlfriend at the same time and it's just causes so much cognitive dissonance. Especially when he treats Uhura the way he does.

Oh, definitely. Uhura got the shaft when it comes to her relationship with Spock. And Spock just...okay, he either feels stuff or he doesn't. You don't get to pick and choose when he feels stuff and when he doesn't.

And I mean, they could have played it with him sort of on the fence, feeling things all the time and trying to hide it, or trying not to feel things because he doesn't want to, but they didn't. So Uhura puts up with the bullshit he spews, only for him to turn around and be all feelings when it comes to Kirk.

And she just...doesn't seem like the kind of character who would. She needs to dump his stupid ass and be done with it. And then be awesome bffs with McCoy.

"And instead [Spock] ends up crying and screaming."

Please tell me there was alien pollen involved. Or Romulan pon farr-inducing drugs. Or mind-control devices. Lie to me if you must.

Umm…well, this is after Vulcan was destroyed, Amanda died, Pike died, and the Enterprise had just been attacked. Spock cries while Kirk is dying and once he's dead he screams and then runs off to beat the tar out of "Khan."

Don't know if that helps…sorry.

No. I actually like Pine's Kirk better than Shatner's Kirk, but Quinto's Spock totally doesn't work for me.

Same.

Quinto looked the part. There is a strong resemblence between him and Leonard Nimoy. If Nimoy were still working I could see him as either a younger version of Nimoy's character or even as that character's son. But he sure as heck didn't act like the Spock I knew and loved.

One thing showed was how difficult it is to play a Vulcan and get the mix of not showing emotions, while making it clear you have them. It was a reminder just how good Nimoy, Mark Lenard, Tim Russ, Jolene Blalock and Gray Graham were in their portrayals of Vulcans.

The writers don't understand how to write a Vulcan without making them an asshole. To be fair this is not a problem unique to the reboot.

I agree with you. Kirk is meant to be somewhat charismatic, but Chris Pine is kind of forgettable.

Honestly, I think he was chosen for his chemistry with Quinto (since I believe Quinto was one of the first actors cast). With that in mind, I can see why they went with Pine -- those two are great together during interviews. I'd even hazard to say it's more entertaining than the film and I know a number of Trek fans who are more excited for the interview circuit than the actual third reboot movie.

Too bad they wrote Spock and Kirk's friendship so horribly in the reboot then...

*Sigh*

It just kills me because there are moments of genuine emotional connection sometimes, but they're always undermined by the writers relying too much on what's come before or destiny or making references to past films.

Moments where Kirk listens to Spock after he raises objections to killing Harrison or when Kirk admits that Spock is the one the Enterprise needs right now -- those are actually good and build their characters.

But Spock screaming "Khan!" just isn't and the writers seem to take it for granted ALL the time that the audience is just going to believe it because it's "supposed" to be that way.

Agreed. References don't make for good writing, the writing itself actually has to be good.

I think that "KHAAAAAN!" moment was supposed to be touching? Like Spock's death scene was in the original, right?

But it was so self-consciously self-referential at this point that it's pure camp, and when I saw it opening night, most of the theater burst out laughing. Totally killed any gravity that scene might have had.

Yeah, the Khan scream was just…WTF were they thinking?

And I could tell that Pine and Quinto were trying their damnedest to sell that scene too but then the Khan scream shits all over it.

It's absolutely ridiculously and it's a perfect example of the writers screwing over the story so that they can include this stupidity.

Urgh...

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[ SECRET POST #2776 ]

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100% This

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Am I the only one who thinks Quinto's worse?

Re: Am I the only one who thinks Quinto's worse?

Re: Am I the only one who thinks Quinto's worse?

Re: Am I the only one who thinks Quinto's worse?

Re: Am I the only one who thinks Quinto's worse?

Re: Am I the only one who thinks Quinto's worse?

Re: Am I the only one who thinks Quinto's worse?

Re: Am I the only one who thinks Quinto's worse?

Re: Am I the only one who thinks Quinto's worse?

Re: Am I the only one who thinks Quinto's worse?

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