fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #341 ]

⌈ Secret Post #341 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Uhhh, made one not!fandom that shouldn't have been there. Fixed now! Uhhhh sorry 46.

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 100 secrets from Secret Submission Post #049.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 ] broken links, [ 1 2 ] not!secrets, [ 1 ] not!fandom, [ 1 ] too big.
Next Secret Post: Tomorrow, Thursday, December 13th, 2007.
Current Secret Submission Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

27. Terra Branford and Celes Chere would like to have a word with you.

And Rydia.

And Agrias Oaks

And Beatrix

And Freya Crescent.

And Ashe.

Terra would like to have several potentially loud and explosive words. X3

(I'd also add Fran to that list, personally)

Oh yes, Fran goes in, too! And come to think of it, Relm as well.

Edited 2007-12-13 00:36 (UTC)

And Faris!

Come on, she's the captain of a motherfucking pirate ship.

FF6 was basically full of men getting whipped by the, what, three girls on crew? Perhaps OP has failed to play the classics.

How could I forget Faris?!

Well, I don't necessarily blame you -- sometimes I like to forget FF5 too, if only to make myself feel better about the 32890484 hours I wasted trying not to get completely owned by zombie chipmunks.

I got to the boat graveyard and called it quits because I wasn't finding it significantly different from FFIV.

Although this was 6 years ago on an emulator and before I got into the deliciousness that is the character class system in FFTactics. PERHAPS I SHOULD REPLAY.

This thread is full of win. XDD

Although I don't think the OP was necessarily implying that Paine was the only STRONG woman in the FF series, just the only one that appealed to her. Different strokes for different folks, I guess: I actually found Paine to be incredibly, irritatingly cliche, especially compared to... uh, pretty much every girl named in this post. :P Poor Final Fantasy girls- they get such a bad rap.

I don't see what makes Paine especially different than the other ladies listed, except perhaps for the amount of leather and studs she wears.

And well, saying that something comes out of a misogynistic culture is like saying water is wet.

Well, I don't either, but the OP did mention that she's played all the FF games so, I dunno. Either we're seeing something she's not or she's seeing something we're not. I vote for the former circumstance, but I enjoy being diplomatic.

Edited 2007-12-13 01:53 (UTC)

Thank you. I found Paine to be a little too blatantly pushing for the "look, this game has a strong female character!" role, rather than actually being a more honest sort of strong character. I mean, Celes can sing opera and be strong, she doesn't need to dress like a dominatrix to do it. Paine always struck me as the developers trying too hard to give the feminists a character to like, without really understanding what it was people were asking for.

I like Paine, but in terms of cliche or stereotypical, I thought she was one of the FF females who fell into a stereotype the easiest.

I like Paine, but in terms of cliche or stereotypical, I thought she was one of the FF females who fell into a stereotype the easiest.

Hm, I have to wonder; which steereotype? That is, what other FF characters have been of this stereotype to make it so tiresome?

That said, I'm tired of the "women don't have to wear leather and be all blunt and taciturn to be strong" argument. Yes, it's perfectly true, but how many characters like this do we generally see? Meanwhile the FF games are brimming with strong female characters of the dress-wearing, singing, flower-arranging variety.

Lulu? Hell, when I first saw screenshots for X-2, the first thing I thought was, "Hey, why did Lulu cut her hair?"

I don't mean the "woman with black studded leather and a sword" is a FF stereotype, but let's face it, it's not like it's an unfamiliar sight in videogames. Most women who kick ass look something like that.

As for FF women who don't look like that but aren't dress-wearing, singing, flower-arranging? Faris, for sure - she's a reverse trap pirate captain. Celes was a general of the Imperial army (does the singing in that scene count? She still isn't, what was her phrase? An opera floozy?), and Terra had been a slave of the Empire since childhood and was a soldier as well, if against her will. Tifa was a terrorist, I don't recall any flower arranging out of her. I don't honestly recall FFIX well enough to say anything of Freya, but Beatrix was a general as well. Ashe did indeed wear dresses, but iirc, the first in-game scene we see with her, she's just failed an asassination attempt. I don't think she was into the flower arranging or singing at all.

it's not like it's an unfamiliar sight in videogames. Most women who kick ass look something like that.

Sadly, I haven't got time to play as much as I used to, and what I do play are RPGs. I can't actually recall anybody else like that.

I also haven't played any FF games before VI yet (though I have played all but XI since), but I've heard about Faris before.

Celes was a general, but secretly yearning to be something softer IIRC (though I might have her confused with somebody else - it's been a long time since I played).

Terra's only fierce aspects were those forced upon her - she was really a caring, loving person.

Tifa's highest hope when growing up was to be saved by a hero (while Cloud, who was the same age, wanted to be a hero). She also spent the game being Cloud's support rather than a terrorist.

Beatrix somewhat breaks the mold, and she still lost her head when she thought she had recieved a love letter, and Freya only became a knight because of her boyfriend.

Ashe is completely different I think (though I haven't finished the game yet, so I don't know); she pursues power for her own sake, to reclaim her kingdom, and isn't afraif to use it. She is nobody's support structure - the party is mainly there to support her, and generally she's got more in common with Square's othe male leads than their female.

Now, I'm not saying these characters are bad; they just have a mindset that puts them in the background and makes them passive. They don't make things happen, things happen to them, and their goals generally don't involve "selfish" things, like being at the top of your field or gaining power.

It's really all in the mindset. It's not always what a character does, but how and why.

These characters also aren't weak. No, that's not what I'm saying at all. Their sort of strenght though, is so overly represented in female characters that I'm starting to wonder if people truly believe that it's the only way a woman can be strong.

Can popcorn and folded chairs be brought to the watchings of these exchanges of words and win? Because I think they need to be there.

[ SECRET POST #341 ]

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