fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2869 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2869 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 061 secrets from Secret Submission Post #410.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I agree with you that she's a horrible person. That being said, it bugs me that people say she's the worst characters. Because no. Third worst, but not the worst. Actually murdering lots of innocent people is worse. Raping an innocent woman and planning on raping her daughter is worse.

Oh, no, I get that. I just wish people would stop making her out to be the poor, poor pitiful woman who ~just wanted a family~.

No, the pies thing was her idea, she encouraged him, etc.

Yeah, but don't forget that Lovett is cheerfully complicit in the murders of all those innocent people, and she doesn't have the dubious excuse of being unhinged by grief and injustice. She's as amoral as they come.

I absolutely agree with that. She is a horrible person. It is just that a lot of people say she's the worst person in the musical (sometimes in ways that strike me as somewhat sexist). I still think she's the third worst and a horrible person, but Todd and the Judge are both worse than her.

I tend to think that neither she nor Todd separately would have been as terrible as they became together.

And I say this as someone who's spent a semester's worth of voice lessons preparing her songs and who's longing to do "A Little Priest" if I can only convince one of the baritones in the studio to do it with me.

I agree to this.

Rape is not worse than murder, dammit. That is SUCH a fucking creepy attitude.

Yeah, the implication that a rape victim would be better off dead is really unnerving.

Objectively, no, but let's have some context here. Turpin has Benjamin Barker convicted for crimes he didn't commit and transported specifically to clear the way for him to rape Lucy Barker. Then, after she poisons herself and is committed to Bedlam, he takes in her infant daughter, and raises her in isolation, grooming her to be his wife. I think there is a decent argument to be made here that it takes a more evil individual to willfully construct that kind of misery than to slit a throat, and that is not the same as saying that rape is worse than murder.

However, and to bring this back on topic, Mrs. Lovett is an amoral sociopath who chooses to use all this horror to her advantage and egg Sweeney Todd on his killing spree for fun, profit, and the chance to pretend that her insane, grieving crush is her for-real boyfriend, and manages to completely fuck up at least one innocent (Toby) in the process. It's a bit of a stretch to say she's any less evil than Turpin or Todd.

Basically, Sweeney Todd is about horrible people in horrible circumstances doing horrible things to one another and singing. Also, Joanna/Anthony.

[ SECRET POST #2869 ]

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