[ SECRET POST #2879 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2879 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 017 secrets from Secret Submission Post #411.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[philstar22]

The thing is for me, though, foreshadowing is not the same as developing a relationship. I could see things in the earlier books that hinted that Harry/Ginny would become canon (though there were other things in the books that said otherwise to me) . But for me there were no development of feelings. Ginny had a crush on the "boy who lived" which she then got over. Harry showed no feelings for her whatsoever and barely even acknowledged her existence. Then, out of the blue, feelings were there.

I'm just saying that I need development in romances, and "out of the blue" means for me there is no development regardless of what foreshadowing may or may not have been there.

[(Anonymous)]

Harry showed no feelings for her whatsoever and barely even acknowledged her existence. Then, out of the blue, feelings were there.

tbf that's hardly out of character for a teenage boy

[philstar22]

I agree with that. But I also don't think the crushes of teenagers are the same thing as love or the type of thing that becomes a long-lasting relationship. Like, I could buy Harry's chest-monster thing as a teenage crush, but I couldn't buy it as love.

[(Anonymous)]

I think it is separate from what we call love, but could also develop into it as time goes by. Which I guess I would say is my headcanon, if I have one.

but I'm hardly super-committed to this, it's mostly just dumb Harry Potter relationship writing anyway. I'm just saying, it's not necessarily unheard of.

[philstar22]

Possibly. I just personally feel we didn't get that on paper, which is why I consider the romance out of the blue. But that is just my personal opinion.

I was mostly just responding to the OP who said they didn't understand "out of the blue" because of foreshadowing. I was just saying that foreshadowing for me has nothing to do with whether a relationship was out of the blue or not.

[(Anonymous)]

Not in real life, no.

But as they say, fiction differs from real life because fiction has to make sense. If a reader needs to guess at the way a character behaves/feels despite there being little in the narrative to back it up is pretty lazy writing.

[(Anonymous)]

But as they say, fiction differs from real life because fiction has to make sense.

I disagree.

[(Anonymous)]

O_o

What was that last thing you read that made no sense whatsoever, not even within the context of its own internal rules and logic?

[(Anonymous)]

I hate these stupid blanket statements.

[kallanda_lee]

Yes, you summarized quite nicely why it felt "out of the blue" for me, too. I just didn't see it until it was there.

[(Anonymous)]

This. You can foreshadow something all you want, but if you don't devote the time to actually developing it and making it plausible within the frame of canon, it's going to come across as being out of the blue.

[(Anonymous)]

Not OP --

Yeah, I get what you're saying. I can't imagine being *surprised* by Harry/Ginny, because the relationship is a giant cliche, but the romance part of the relationship, if there was any, all happened off-screen. So, it's a little unsatisfying.

I think JKR just felt like she knew who was going to wind up together in the end, so she didn't have to show her work. (See: Remus/Tonks)

However, I don't think any relationship was ever played up as "end-game" more than Ron/Hermione. If someone didn't like the relationship, that's one thing. But if they didn't think it was going to happen, then they need to check their reading comprehension.

[philstar22]

I agree with all of this. I don't like Ron/Hermione at all, but it was clear that was where the books were going. And it was clear they had feelings for each other from at least book 4 on. There weren't any other relationships that were developed in the same way.

[nightscale]

This is why it felt out of place for me too and it was honestly one of the relationships that I didn't spot coming at all because, aside from Ginny's crush on Harry, there was no build up to it. It just happened.

Whereas Ron/Hermione I saw coming for a long time even if I never cared for it much.

[(Anonymous)]

I stopped reading before the Harry/Ginny relationship happened and when I heard about it I was completely confused and weirded out because it came out of the fucking nowhere. But that's probably also because I -for some weird reason- always perceived Ginny as much younger than Harry even though she obviously wasn't, so...

[(Anonymous)]

The thing is for me, though, foreshadowing is not the same as developing a relationship.

This is certainly true, and I don't feel any great desire to debate about whether Harry/Ginny was well developed. I think it is as well developed as any other relationship in HP, but that's a very low bar to cross, so I can't say it was actually well developed.

But it was pretty clear to me early on that it was Rowling's endgame, and while most of the people claiming it was a last minute swerve that nobody could have seen coming are hardcore (read: "delusional") Harmonians, enough sane ones do exist to confuse me.

^ That's OP, of course.

[(Anonymous)]

I forgot to change the subject line.

[dahli]

So much this.

[annethecatdetective]

Yeah, I see exactly what you're talking about.

For me it was Lupin/Tonks-- there was ZERO development before they were suddenly a thing, and while I realize that they only had limited page time and so it's not as egregious as having such limited development for the main character's romance... it just really felt out of nowhere to me. Especially since seeing her changed patronus through Harry's eyes meant we didn't even really get foreshadowing.

I went back through looking for hints on a second read and I still couldn't find anything that made me believe in them, and it would have been nice to just have some scenes between them before she busts out with the 'I'm in love with you and you need to get over all your reasons for pushing me away'.

[philstar22]

I completely agree. And I actually like Remus/Tonks a lot. I shipped them before they were canon. But the way they were written didn't work for me. There weren't hints. And I get that the books were from Harry's perspective which limited things, but there was just nothing that made me think they would be canon.

[annethecatdetective]

Yeah. I wasn't sold on the writing, which after how good I found most of the foreshadowing and building for other aspects of the series, was disappointing. I liked everything with Teddy more than I liked any other aspect of their relationship outside of parenthood as it was written... not that we had much there, either, but we certainly had more of that than we did of any kind of build.

I never really went for the ship before, but I have seen some really great fanart for them, so... Like, definitely the fans had to fill in so much that we didn't get in the canon with them.

[philstar22]

I just don't think that romance is Rowling's strong suit. As much as I love the books, I didn't think any of the relationships were written well except some of the adult married couples that we only saw briefly.

[annethecatdetective]

I saw the relationship between Ron and Hermione build from the second book on in a way that worked for me, but yeah, beyond that... there was a lot that threw me off, or that we just didn't see enough of for me to *get*. Or, I mean, there were also plenty of things that felt like realistic teen dating troubles going on in the background, which was fine but didn't have an impact on the story for me or which I could have done without when it felt like they bogged down the story rather than building it up.