[ SECRET POST #3257 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3257 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.


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02.


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03. [SPOILERS for Downton Abbey Season 6]



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04. [SPOILERS for Mockingjay Part 2]



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05. [SPOILERS for Undertale]



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06. [WARNING for rape]



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07. [WARNING for rape]



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08. [WARNING for child abuse]

[King Lear]


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09. [WARNING for abuse]

[Tales From the Borderlands]


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10. [WARNING for abuse, PTSD]

[Jessica Jones]









Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #465.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

07. [WARNING for rape]
http://i.imgur.com/ybZvyoo.png

[(Anonymous)]

They are all fucking horrible characters (in their actions, not their crafting as literary figures)

[(Anonymous)]

That sure is a fugly hairstyle he's got there.

[(Anonymous)]

They'd probably say it's because 1 in 4 women isn't going to experience genocide, cannibalism, or torture in her lifetime.

[(Anonymous)]

Well, in 1 in 4 women don't get raped so they don't know what they are talking about. The 1 in 4 statistic is inflated and outdated (and has been disproven over and over).

[(Anonymous)]

By misogynistic MRA's like Christina Hoff Summers. If she told me the sky is blue I would doubt her, never mind her calling rape victims liars.

[(Anonymous)]

Didn't the 1/4 statistic come from this lady asking a bunch of questions about people's lives, and then deciding whether or not they'd been raped in each instance, even if the person hadn't said they'd been raped?

Like, the question was "have you ever had sex after drinking" someone says "yes" the person running the survey says "you were raped" even if the person who said yes didn't think so?

Plus there was no differentiation between people who'd have consensual sex after a glass of wine and people who were actually were raped.

But whatever, I'm going to call you an MRA troll trying to make feminists look bad.

[(Anonymous)]

What? You must be the troll. Being raped doesn't depend on whether you think you were raped or not.

[(Anonymous)]

Also by the CDC and RAINN. I guess they are all misogynists?

[(Anonymous)]

I'm not saying it's true, but it's impossible to disprove.

[(Anonymous)]

1 in 4 figure was always women who've experienced sexual assault, not rape. People just misquote it.

Even by most conservative figures, 1 in 8 women is raped during life. Most realistic figures probably 1 in 6.

[(Anonymous)]

Well, that's an optimistic projection.

[(Anonymous)]

While we can debate the actual numbers (it could be higher or lower) I agree that this is the reasons. A while back someone posted a great essay on why people who read Harry Potter tend hate Deloris Umbridge more than they hate Voldemort - the upshot being that very few have had a personal encounter with a Voldemort type character (leader of a genocidal cult) almost everyone has had dealt with someone like Umbridge - a vicious teacher who seems to take a sadistic glee in punishing a student. They same could apply here....

[(Anonymous)]

Way to ignore the actual point, martyr.

[ibbity]

My guess would be that it's because these people complaining find rape a lot more relatable than, say, summoning a horde of aliens to destroy Manhattan. So they find it personally threatening and scary in a way that aliens destroying Manhattan are not.

[(Anonymous)]

(Not OP) That's exactly it.

[helenadax]

Poor Draco, once again he's surrounded by bigger baddies than he is.

Also, although some villains are among my favourite characters, I hated Kilgrave 's guts and I wanted to see him suffering and paying for everything.

[nightscale]

I liked him in the sense that I thought he was a good villain and worked very well at being a completely creepy fucker and I don't think liking him is a problem, excusing his actions on the other hand isn't cool.

I think there's also the sense that while all the other villains(save Draco) are definitely absolutely horrible people they're also completely fictional, the chances of running into a Loki irl are slim to none, whereas Kilgrave's exist everywhere. They just don't have the power to control minds(thank god).

TL;DR, I know

[elaminator]

Eh, I don't like Kilgrave in the slightest (which is different from thinking he's not a well written character; he's a fantastically written, terrifying character), but I'm not going to tell others they can't enjoy him. What they like is their business; I don't have to understand it or feel similarly.

As for Voldemort, Loki, Hannibal, etc, of the ones I know: they're horrible people. Don't see much use in denying that; no matter what their reasons (and their reasons tend to be pretty eye-roll worthy, to me), they're still horrible. (Though, uh...I don't think Draco is quite on the same level as the others. Not that he isn't still a brat, but I wouldn't call him Voldemort, Loki, or Hannibal bad. I never finished the series so I could be wrong, but I remember reading about the last book and nothing like that jumped out at me.)

The difference between Hannibal and Kilgrave for me is that I can still find something to like about Hannibal. I've heard a lot of "Kilgrave is charming!" and don't at all get it because he's so damn rude and cruel all the time. Hannibal is a monster, but he has manners and seems to 'care' on a less superficial (though still incredibly twisted and wrong) level than Kilgrave does (because I don't think Kilgrave cares, at all, even superficially), so there are moments with him that take me off guard. He pulls off 'charming' better because he actually makes an effort to be cordial and doesn't go around killing and torturing people for 'no reason'. (Don't get me wrong, his 'reasons' are batshit insane, what with the way he thinks some people are no better than cattle so there's no harm in eating them, but it's easier for me to not completely hate a character who maintains a degree of normalcy and geniality some of the time and has their own 'code', fucked up as it might be, to someone like Kilgrave who I just find vile and disgusting all the time because there are no limits with him. There is nothing he won't do. Plus, Hannibal is of course a show that focuses on Hannibal from a more sympathetic POV, so that has something to do with it too; we constantly see Kilgrave through the eyes of his victims.)

That, and...the rape. Hannibal and Kilgrave are both serial killers (and abusers), but rape is one thing I have a hard time being okay with, even in fiction. (I suppose because it feels more 'real' to me, and murder, as awful as it is, is everywhere, even in kids games, so I'm more desensitized to it in a fictional setting. You aren't as likely to meet a cannibal or a mass murderer as you are someone more like Kilgrave, who won't take no for an answer, is obsessive and has no conscience.)

Loki...I find Loki to be more sympathetic than Kilgrave (not that it takes much for that), but I still think Loki is an ass-wipe. I can see the appeal (on some level; not to the extent that others do), but I don't agree with the parts of the fandom who think he does no wrong. They're all plenty wrong, but that doesn't mean people won't find something to enjoy about them. (Complexity included. People are often drawn to villains or antagonists that they see as complex, and fascinated by them because of all their faults. In that regard though, I don't get being fascinated by Kilgrave because he's pretty straight-forward. I think that just makes him more terrifying, though.)

Re: TL;DR, I know

[(Anonymous)]

Agree with all of this.


I love Kilgrave as a character, in that I think he's a great villain, and I can see people finding him compelling and wanting to write fucked up fic about him and all that... but he's also scarily close to some people in real life, to real evil that actually happens.

Re: TL;DR, I know

[elaminator]

Kilgrave is easily one of the most realistic and believable super villains I've ever seen. I find it incredibly easy to understand people's discomfort with him; with some minor changes, he could be a real person.

[philstar22]

I agree with this so much. I don't like Kilgrave other than finding him an interesting character. I don't ship him with anyone. But I absolutely strongly believe in fiction is fiction and your kink is not my kink and that is okay. Fiction is a safe way of exploring kinks. Yes, Kilgrave is much more realistic other than the superpowers. It doesn't matter. People can still like what they like. Nothing wrong with that. He is fictional.

[iggy]

Draco is different from the rest. I'm not much of a fan though, but he... comes around before he's fully gone. He's mean, but not evil.

The rest of the characters are horrid people though, and I don't think woobification of any of them is okay. Most of the people that I personally know who criticize the Kilgrave fandom would feel the same.

[(Anonymous)]

From what little I've seen, outright "liking" Kilgrave is pretty uncommon. Almost everyone acknowledges that he's pretty much the worst human being imaginable.

I think it's all right to enjoy his presence on the show though (as I do). I admit to laughing at a ton of his lines, and then feeling bad about it right after. Dammit, Kilgrave.

[(Anonymous)]

The difference for me is that Voldemort/Hannibal/Loki are all overt evils. They make no secret of what they are, and to themselves at least are honest about their villainy. Whereas you have Kilgrave, who for the most part thinks he did nothing wrong.
We can tolerate and even like a villain who is honest about it, but Kilgrave's subtle brand of rape-y evil is far too much like real-life evil.