[ SECRET POST #3575 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3575 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 35 secrets from Secret Submission Post #511.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

I'm a little skeptical, at this point, of people taking the line about feminist analysis being flawed because Western. Because IME it's astonishing how often 'non-western-ness' gets positioned and used as a justification for just astonishingly awful shit. It just feels like it's used as nothing more than a stalking horse.

That said i have no feelings about this specific outlet. Idk anything, whatever.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm from a non-Western cultural background, and while I'm not going to say analysis of Eastern culture through a Western lens is useless, a whole lot of it heavily biased and ignores culture, context, and history in favor of calling out all the ways it deviates from Western norms which are accepted as superior and ideal without question... ironically from a stance that should really seek to question Western social norms just as much.

Analysis of Western culture through an Eastern lens is similarly heavily biased.

[(Anonymous)]

I agree that the issue exists. But in practice, people in anime fandom seem more interested in gesturing at the idea and using it as a blanket defense against criticism than they do in actually engaging with the idea. Again, in my experience.

[(Anonymous)]

I agree some people use it as a shield to be dismissive of any criticism, which is unfortunate. But I can see where some of those people are coming from since so much of the criticism is bad. It's like 99% of fanfiction, you have to be willing to sift through the crap and lots of people aren't. :(

[feotakahari]

It took me a while to figure this out, but I think people have a more accurate view when they talk about "society" than when they talk about "culture." "Culture" tends to mean the dominant group, e.g. how "American culture" and "African-American culture" don't mean the same thing. By all rights, African-Americans are as American as anyone else, but "American culture" mainly means the culture of white people, because notwithstanding our current president, African-Americans as a collective don't have a lot of power. "Society," on the other hand, refers to everyone, and it seems like people who talk about "society" are more aware of how power structures intersect.

[(Anonymous)]

I think that's the best way I've heard 'culture' vs 'society' described.
Also completely agree.

[iggy]

Non-Western does get used to justify a lot of undeniably terrible shit. Like no, this moe pedo bait show is not considered 'normal' to like in Japan and it is worth criticizing. A very small subset of society likes it and most people probably think it's kind of gross? But if you say that to some people they'll just accuse you of being a prudish American.

But then on the flip you've got the people who insist that all magical girl shows written for a female audience are super feminist, even though, according to most Japanese feminists, as per their society, they're usually not. And of course, the infamous 'Kill la Kill is feminist' articles.

There's definitely a balance, but on the whole I'm kind of wary of a site called 'anime feminist'.

[(Anonymous)]

Wait... it being niche is part of the argument for criticizing it? I thought it was all about criticizing overall tendencies present in mainstream. What you're saying sounds kinda like "ugh this sexploitation shit show is not considered normal to watch in the US and should be criticized". No, FFS, it's a niche genre that has its own inherent value in the spectrum of things. it even serves as a lens through which we can critically evaluate the mainstream.
bashing subculture is NOT what criticism (feminist or otherwise) should be about, and it's exactly what leads to the stuff people call out as "western norms being forced on media from other cultures"

[(Anonymous)]

Um... no... the criticism has nothing to do with it being a subculture. And it's not saying it should stop being made. It's "Here is cultural context for the thing. Now here is what we find wrong with it from our own perspective. People who have a similar distaste for this kind of thing (due to being influenced by the same cultural norms, or for other reasons) will probably want to avoid it."

Why should people not be saved the time and annoyance of watching something they won't like just because the review they read was ~influenced by outside cultural values?~ They're not trying to influence what gets made in Japan. How hard is it wrap your heads around the idea of criticism =/= cries for censorship.